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PostPosted: Tue Sep 29, 2015 5:38 am 
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Hmm, not seen Huntingdon look like that! :lol:

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White Dolomite 1850 HWM 572P

Bill.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:20 pm 
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Time to update this thread, though with a bit of a mixed bag of results from my recent work it has to be said, a frustrating two steps forward one step back feeling.

I'll start with the gearbox mount that I had noted was made from black blancmange (though that's basically saying black white but hey) being replaced. This was refitted a few times due to loud gearbox whine and engine sounds making me think that I had done something in error. This in fact proved to be that current mounts are supplied with a hardness level in excess of 70 shore. When you consider that a bowling bowl is 100 shore, and the OEM mount is 45 shore you get an idea of the hardness. So car pulls away smartly from the lights without shaking itself to bits, but now sounds like trackday car with a crash box.

Image

Bought five original wheels after finding a set just up the road in Earith for £60, belonged to a nice lady who owned a TR7 that the wheels were destined for, but had decided to keep the original TR7 wheels when her insurance company said that alloys are a modification. They were in a bit of a state, had been painted with silver paint with green inserts. Spent a Saturday with paint remover, wire wool and a lot of elbow grease, and I think that considering the tyres stayed on, that they have come up quite nicely. Will do a better job at the next tyre change.

Before, though I had painted on the paint remover at this stage:
Image

And after (like you needed that pointing out! Mind you, can't tell that the silver paint has gone and that it is now polished alloy):
Image

Because the performance is not exactly sparkling, and I am in no way impressed with the standard of previous work, I thought I would start with taking a look at the ignition side of things. Previous experience has taught me that you get the ignition system sorted out first before even thinking of looking at fuelling or elsewhere.

Box of new parts arrived; leads, distributor cap, rotor and coil from Powerspark (simonbbc), module from Britpart:

Image

Cap is certainly a lot taller!:

Image

Been a few years since I've peered inside a Lucas dizzy, made me feel all nostalgic:

Image

With all the new bits fitted, including new 12v supply to the coil, I went to start the car and nothing. Fine, so I knew it would need the timing redoing but I thought it would actually start at least so that I could dynamically set it. Took off the coil HT lead and looked for a spark and found nothing at all. Checked all my work and could find nothing wrong, went away and googled for some answers and found a couple of threads mentioning the height of the magnetic ring in relation to the pickup caused an issue. Found a suitable O ring to put on top of the dizzy shaft that would make the magnets sit higher.

Image

Success! Well sort of, started but seconds later stalled with a disturbing screech. Timing then I thought, and so with seeing no obvious way of turning over the engine from the front, jacked up the rear and enlisted the help of an assistant (with thanks to my housemate). I had to turn the dizzy full clockwise to get the right BTDC figure, this didn't seem right at all, and not only that but it meant that the rear spring clip for the cap was now inaccessible.

Took the car for a test drive, this was not good as the car was wildly misfiring like a thing that misfires an awful lot. So, after my hours simple job had taken many more, and it was now Sunday, in desperation I took out my spare distributor and cleaned it up and transferred everything across. The magnets certainly fitted on tighter to the shaft, but sadly with pretty much the same results. Ripped out the Britpart module and put the old points in, gapped them as best as I could as there is a deep pit in them even after trying to flatten them, and static timed the distributor. Started first turn and sounded so much better, test drive showed it to be much smoother and far more torque than before, specially setting off from rest. Not sure if that was the timing being set correctly or the new coil, leads etc.

So contact points win? Well not so fast, I now have a misfire at high speed, so not completely! I have changed so many things that I'm going to have to reverse everything I have done to find the culprit, maybe it's the new coil, leads etc or the spare distributor which seemed to have one weak spring on the advance weights. So some decisions to be made, just a new set of points which was not the plan, because as nostalgic as setting the points was, I was hoping for a bit more fit and forget and removing the annoying repeated setting of them, or try another electronic unit that's not the Britpart one.

Still, I'm happy with the wheels...

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Current fleet: Triumph Dolomite Sprint '75, Daihatsu Fourtrak, Honda CG125, Yamaha Fazer 600, Shetland 570

Disposal fleet: Golf GTi 16v MK3 Anniversary, Tiger Avon (unbuilt)

Past fleet: Triumph 2000, Lancia Beta Coupe, BL Mini Clubman, Austin Metro, Vauxhall Cavalier MK1 & MK2, Renault 18 D, Rover 216 GSI, Honda Accord (most expensive car purchase, hated it on pickup from dealer, was made out of magnetic metal as only car I've ever been crashed into, 4 times), Golf GTi MK3 16v x 3


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2015 8:15 pm 
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Location: Dalgety Bay, Fife, Scotland
Really loving this car, wishing you all the very best with it :-)

Kind Regards

Russell

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Russell A Macfarlane
Dalgety Bay, Fife, Scotland
1973 (L) Triumph Dolomite 1850 Manual (Non OD), Old English White
2012 (12) Vauxhall Insignia 1800 Exclusiv, Manual (Non OD!!), Technical Grey


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2015 8:18 pm 
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Location: Huntingdon
Quote:
Really loving this car, wishing you all the very best with it :-)
Thanks Russell, appreciate you saying that.

Raf.

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Current fleet: Triumph Dolomite Sprint '75, Daihatsu Fourtrak, Honda CG125, Yamaha Fazer 600, Shetland 570

Disposal fleet: Golf GTi 16v MK3 Anniversary, Tiger Avon (unbuilt)

Past fleet: Triumph 2000, Lancia Beta Coupe, BL Mini Clubman, Austin Metro, Vauxhall Cavalier MK1 & MK2, Renault 18 D, Rover 216 GSI, Honda Accord (most expensive car purchase, hated it on pickup from dealer, was made out of magnetic metal as only car I've ever been crashed into, 4 times), Golf GTi MK3 16v x 3


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2015 9:48 pm 
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While I've had good success with the britpart module in ohv modeles with the normal 45D4 distributor
I've never had one fitted to the Sprint.

In the past the problem of too high modules has been solved by some folks fitting an ambassador cap, which I think is what you have there.
Reg had an aldon ignitor like this on his Sprint and this dizzy is now IIRC in my tr7 engined car but I cant remember
if I used a std spit/mini cap or the "ambassador" one.

The module we know does work is the lumenition magnetronic one but that's about 90 quid's worth. I did have one fail once too so its an expensive thing to replace. But it does keep the Sprint style cap and rotor arm.

You do need to get the right coil wiring. If you use a ballasted coil you MUST power the module of any sort from the full 12volts and not the 6v that you get at coil plus. This could explain why you start ok but have erratic running, and that putting it back to points has fixed it.

wiki article here
https://dollywiki.co.uk/wiki/Ignition_b ... ss_removal

Jonners

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 6:20 am 
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I had the same experience with my Powerspark kit. In and out 4 times replaced with points and all good every time. I was in conversation with powerspark telling them of my progress and carrying out their instructions so they were happy with my diagnosis, which was- the module was knackered.
They sent another in the post no quibble. Car runs fine on the new one but I still carry a points equipped dizzy in the boot :)

Tony

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 1:24 pm 
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Good call Jonners but I have not only bought a new 12v coil (dry apparently, cost enough!) but also remembered to put in a 12v feed direct from the un-fused side of the ignition switch. Maybe I need to spend a bit more and go for a Lumenition, but to be honest, if I was spending another near £100 I would go the whole hog and fit a Megajolt.

Tony, I'm a bit down on something that fails this early, so I could send it back but my faith in the product has gone now I must admit, though it was worth a try for the small amount it cost. Considering how many people sell an identical looking device, I'm pretty certain they are being pumped out of an assembly line in China for 50p each! The Pertronix Ignitor II looks like a more quality product, comes with adaptive dwell, reverse polarity protection etcetera but its not easy to source in the UK, and at the price charged I would yet again go Megajolt.

Think I'll buy a set of £32 points to keep me going for a while and revisit this, might build my own ignition!

Edit: Too much haste with that post, £2 points and not the new range of Apple iPoints, keyboard bounce whilst typing with a houmous and tomato roll in one hand!

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Current fleet: Triumph Dolomite Sprint '75, Daihatsu Fourtrak, Honda CG125, Yamaha Fazer 600, Shetland 570

Disposal fleet: Golf GTi 16v MK3 Anniversary, Tiger Avon (unbuilt)

Past fleet: Triumph 2000, Lancia Beta Coupe, BL Mini Clubman, Austin Metro, Vauxhall Cavalier MK1 & MK2, Renault 18 D, Rover 216 GSI, Honda Accord (most expensive car purchase, hated it on pickup from dealer, was made out of magnetic metal as only car I've ever been crashed into, 4 times), Golf GTi MK3 16v x 3


Last edited by Galileo on Mon Oct 12, 2015 7:41 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 2:57 pm 
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Hmmm....this doesn’t bode well!

This is the exact same ignition system I have bought!

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 3:03 pm 
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The car's looking great. I have always used the Magnetronics with the Lumenition coil and never had a problem with them.
Quote:
might build my own ignition!
Didn't someone build a distributor-less system using a Ford coilpack? That's probably a general question for everyone! I tried a search and couldn't see anything.

Re drilling out the gearbox mount, you could use a die grinder to do this if the rubber is that hard. Would probably make one hell of a mess though!! :lol:


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 3:23 pm 
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Points at 32 quid? Are they made of gold or irridium?

Its the condensors that have made me move away from points systems on all my cars now. They dont last...

I'd try another moduke and they cost less from that land rover outfit MM 4x4 last time I bought one.

You could also do a maplin kit and keep the points too. Ive done that as well..

Jonners

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 3:34 pm 
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£2

The 3 is the same key as the £ :wink:

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White Dolomite 1850 HWM 572P

Bill.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 5:41 pm 
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It's a shame you're having problems with the electronic ignition. Mine hasn't given me a moment's bother. To be honest I don't know if I'm running a ballast or not. My HL-spec loom would suggest so.

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Toledo Man

West Yorkshire Area Organiser & forum moderator
Meetings take place on the 1st Wednesday of every month at The Hollies Sports & Social Club, 12 Hough Lane, Bramley, Leeds, LS13 3NE
1972 Dolomite 1850 auto (NYE 751L - The rolling restoration)
2008 Citroën C4 Grand Picasso 2.0 HDi Exclusive (MA08 WCL - the modern)
Former stable of SAY 414M (1974 Toledo), GRH 244D (1966 1300fwd), CDB 324L (1973 1500fwd), GGN 573J (1971 1500fwd), DCP 625S (1977 Dolomite 1300) & LCG 367N (1975 Dolomite Sprint) plus 5 Acclaims and that's just the Triumphs!

Check my blog at http://triumphtoledo.blogspot.com

"I can help you stop smoking in bed. Buy a water bed and fill it with petrol." - Bob Monkhouse OBE (1928-2003)


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 7:22 pm 
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I was the same tbh, but once I'd got a good 50 pence unit that worked it was all good. Ive probably done 600 miles since i fitted the working unit and its been good under load and hot/cold conditions. If I was committed to the sprint engine id bite the bullet and get a superb 123 distributor from our Dutch friends, but as Im not , I'm not :)

Tony

Tony, I'm a bit down on something that fails this early, so I could send it back but my faith in the product has gone now I must admit, though it was worth a try for the small amount it cost. Considering how many people sell an identical looking device, I'm pretty certain they are being pumped out of an assembly line in China for 50p each! The Pertronix Ignitor II looks like a more quality product, comes with adaptive dwell, reverse polarity protection etcetera but its not easy to source in the UK, and at the price charged I would yet again go Megajolt.

Think I'll buy a set of £32 points to keep me going for a while and revisit this, might build my own ignition![/quote]

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 7:34 pm 
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Location: Huntingdon
Quote:
£2

The 3 is the same key as the £ :wink:
Oops, this! I shall leave an edit, rather than actually edit or these posts won't make sense to the casual viewer!

The Britpart module did come from MM4X4, £23.89 with the VAT and P&P they are now. I am minded to give them a shout and see what they say, I just feel a tad awkward in that I am using it in an application that it was not quite sold for.
Quote:
...Didn't someone build a distributor-less system using a Ford coilpack? That's probably a general question for everyone! I tried a search and couldn't see anything...
The Megajolt does use the Ford wasted spark coilpack and EDIS module. On it's own the EDIS will run at a set 10° BTDC, so it needs a controller to do the funky stuff, such as MAP sensing, and engine speed advance and adjustment etc. My own opinion is that the Megajolt has become very overpriced, maybe because I can remember the DIY kits going for £50. I've got a complete VW/Bosch 16v Digifant 3 system in my box of bits, curves and mapping would be ever so slight wrong though, as would be the missing fuel injection! The Megajolt is now around £125, but add in the trigger wheel, EDIS module etc and you're looking at around £350. Annoyingly I seem to have kept a Ford coilpack, but forgot to hang on to the EDIS module itself when I took out a Mondeo 2L engine and scrapped the car for my kit car project that shall remain unmentioned. (psst, wanna buy a chassis?!)
Quote:
Hmmm....this doesn’t bode well!

This is the exact same ignition system I have bought!
Ah, well, in that case we might find out if it's just a dodgy module, or if there are two ignition modules suited for 8V 45D4 shortly to go up in the for sale section! :lol: Mind you, if you get it to work do share!
Quote:
It's a shame you're having problems with the electronic ignition. Mine hasn't given me a moment's bother. To be honest I don't know if I'm running a ballast or not. My HL-spec loom would suggest so.
Two wires (white pink being the run feed I think) going to you coil +ve would give the game away about having a ballasted ignition circuit.
Quote:
...If I was committed to the sprint engine id bite the bullet and get a superb 123 distributor from our Dutch friends...
Not a 44D listed on http://www.123ignition.nl/ but I did see that http://www.123ignition-conversions.com/ do conversions of a sent in dizzy, question is do they have a map and I'm not sure that they do. What's the relationship between those two, are they the same people do you know?

All good fun though eh? I've got over my disappointment, it's a learning experience after all, but not the calf pull from leaning over the car for too long! ;)

_________________
Current fleet: Triumph Dolomite Sprint '75, Daihatsu Fourtrak, Honda CG125, Yamaha Fazer 600, Shetland 570

Disposal fleet: Golf GTi 16v MK3 Anniversary, Tiger Avon (unbuilt)

Past fleet: Triumph 2000, Lancia Beta Coupe, BL Mini Clubman, Austin Metro, Vauxhall Cavalier MK1 & MK2, Renault 18 D, Rover 216 GSI, Honda Accord (most expensive car purchase, hated it on pickup from dealer, was made out of magnetic metal as only car I've ever been crashed into, 4 times), Golf GTi MK3 16v x 3


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 10:00 pm 
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I had a look at my electronic ignition and both wires are connected to either side of the coil. I've just been out to mine and I was getting just under 12v at the +ve side of the coil with the ignition switched on so it looks like my ballast has been bypassed and I'm running a 12v coil.

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Toledo Man

West Yorkshire Area Organiser & forum moderator
Meetings take place on the 1st Wednesday of every month at The Hollies Sports & Social Club, 12 Hough Lane, Bramley, Leeds, LS13 3NE
1972 Dolomite 1850 auto (NYE 751L - The rolling restoration)
2008 Citroën C4 Grand Picasso 2.0 HDi Exclusive (MA08 WCL - the modern)
Former stable of SAY 414M (1974 Toledo), GRH 244D (1966 1300fwd), CDB 324L (1973 1500fwd), GGN 573J (1971 1500fwd), DCP 625S (1977 Dolomite 1300) & LCG 367N (1975 Dolomite Sprint) plus 5 Acclaims and that's just the Triumphs!

Check my blog at http://triumphtoledo.blogspot.com

"I can help you stop smoking in bed. Buy a water bed and fill it with petrol." - Bob Monkhouse OBE (1928-2003)


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