The Triumph Dolomite Club - Discussion Forum

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 12:25 pm 
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As some of you will know from my last post I am having a bit of a problem with my clutch, so now looking into a replacement. My 1982 registered 1300 was made towards the end of production and left the factory 14th May 1980.

On line traders seem to suggest that there are two types of clutch for this model and having read Steve's post re changing his flywheel, ask if those with more knowledge can advise me. Like Steve I have found that the prices can be more than double and descriptions vary. Rimmer's show one for the 1300 and one for the 1500 as do Wins with these showing 16.5" dia. Mev Spares site shows one for all the ohv range on the heading but then suggest this only fits the 1500 and has 7.25" / 184mm dia. ANG seem to be a little more clear on this and this is where my query comes from. They say their Borg and Beck kit fits 1300 Dolomites WF27170 onwards, years 1979 to 1980 so within my production dates. This one has 7.25" / 184mm dia. 20 spline and says it is an OE part and give a Unipart equivalent part no. The WF no. means nothing to me, looks nothing like chassis no. engine no. or body no. etc in my records.

Will this fit my car? I will contact them for more clarity but first wanted your input so that I do not end up with the car in bits at a garage and find its wrong, or in fact the other more expensive one is wrong.

Thanks Bob.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 1:02 pm 
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WF prefixed chassis numbers are 1850!

Later 1850 have 20 splines whereas the earlier have 9, so that fits, but I thought the change happened later than that


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 1:42 pm 
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Later cars are single rail, so it should be fine spline, unless someone has changed the box. You can tell by the gate pattern, I think the give away is where reverse is.

A word of warning, when my car had a 1500 I had no end of problems with the clutch, alas like many classic parts some of the kits for sale are cheap nasty rubbish.

Someone on here with a 1300 will be able to direct you to something decent. Mick Dolphin had a new old stock clutch for a 1500, he might have one for a 1300.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 2:09 pm 
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Just spoke to ANG and told him number quoted on site relates to 1850 engine numbers which took him back a little. Said he was pretty sure that the late 1300s had the bigger clutch as fitted to 1500s according to his Unipart lists. He is going to check it all out and get back to me, but in the meantime please if anyone can confirm which clutch to get please let me know.

Thanks Bob.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 2:45 pm 
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1300 is 6.5" clutch, 20 spline if flywheel and gearbox are as standard

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 3:41 pm 
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All 1300 and 1500 Dolomites are 'late' cars, the model wasn't introduced until 1976! The 1500TC had a big splined 'box prior to the launch of the 1500 and 1500HL Dolomites

It was only the 1850 that changed gearbox between early and late.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:59 pm 
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my dolly 1300 is a 7.1/4 clutch/184mm

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Dolomite 1300,1980`V`reg in british racing brown(russet),3.63 diff with 21t speedo pinion,95%poly`d,HL clocks,standard wheels with SE covers wrapt in 175 70 13,mot`d 19-09-2014,been off the since 1990,(july2017) stainless steel exhaust 3-piece.

Dolomite 1300,1977(tax free 1-1-1977),`R`reg in carmine red,bog standard including rust :shock: last time on road 6-2005


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 9:53 pm 
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A car dispatched in May 80 will have an 11 Digit VIN number and not a WBxxxxxDL type commission number (think it's WB for a 1500) The change point from commission to VIN was around Sept 79 IIRC.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:25 am 
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Hi Rob,

My car was first registered 25.04.80. From experience with other Standard cars I wouldn't trust cut off dates, especially so close to change dates. SE (special edition) and 'Limited Edition' cars used left over bits to produce them.

Like you I looked around for a clutch and VERY NEARLY took the plunge, had I done so I would now have the wrong clutch kit.

This is the link for Borg & Beck https://webcat.borgandbeck.com/Home Put in Triumph or Rover to do the search but the kit number for the 7 1/4" kit is HK8917, for the 6 1/2" kit it is HK8930. All else fails give Borg & Beck a ring, I did about another clutch I have.

I have a number of old slightly scored clutch cover that I have taken out of Herald 13/60's, identical to the one I took out of my Dolly, the clutch plates are identical too except mine is 20 spline, the Herald is 10 spline. I cross referenced the cover part number listed by Rimmer with Canley Classics, their site brings up Herald 13/60 + Mk IV Spitfire. The pressure plate GCC197 is under the Unipart part numbers GCC133, GCC134 & GCC168 and Borg & Beck part numbers HE1011, HE2830 & HE3598 as they all cross-refer to QH part number Q10001

The clutch plate is GCP188 165mm 20 spline and also fits the Morris Marina 1.3 plus Triumph Dolomite 1300. I managed to find a pair on ebay for £15 each, from the stamp on them they are 'Borg & Beck approved' so probably ex-BL.

If I were you, I wouldn't trust numbers, I would take your box out and go by what you find, someone could have played with the set up over the past 40 years.

The box I took out was a replacement, possibly 'professionally' re-built, it was nicely painted all over in signal red.

Good luck.

Regards,

Steve


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:14 pm 
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Thanks everyone for your replies.

I have just finished a conversation with Alan from ANG in Nottingham and the information he has given took me one step forward and one back again. He had consulted his reference books, the main one printed in 1981, covering the manufacture of Dollies. This said that all 1300 Dolomites were produced with 6.5" clutch plates except for a batch produced for the British School of Motoring (this rang a bell and remembered reading something about this). My car is definitely not a BSM car having its history from order form onwards, and a Heritage Cert. This he said was the batch they had put the start number from on their site. They had put in the wrong letters and should have been HE and also included the last car in the batch. These cars according to his ref book had a 6.5" cover and 7.25" plates. The question seemed answered, mine should then be 6.5" standard, the expensive one. But no. Then he said we have more complications because the Borg and Beck, AP, Lockhead catalogues, which he also crossed refered to Unipart, all give two clutch's with a change late in the production. This clutch matches the 1500 clutch so back to square one. He doesnt have any of the much more expensive 1300 clutches quoting supply and demand, but any way he suggested what I was already thinking, to take out the clutch see whats fitted and go from there. He sees no other option and at the moment nor do I.

Last night I went on Mick Dolphins site having seen cleverusernames post. His database seems to coroberate what Alan says at ANG.

GCP244 Borg and Beck plate Dolomite 1300 + late Tol.

GCP230 Borg and Beck plate Dolomite 1500 + late 1300 (looks like he doesn't have any in stock)

Tamtrucks, when was yours manufactured, could it be a BSM car? It may help in the investigations.

Standardthread, Hi Steve.

The car is as it left the factory and was purchased by a BL worker for his retirement, putting it away for almost 3 years hence its very late registration. He kept it until he had to stop driving in his 90s so keeping its originality and low mileage. It had a replacement clutch fitted in 1994 but nothing in the records helps with what was fitted. Going to have a look on borg and becks site to see if I can bottom this.

Thanks Bob.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:44 pm 
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Borg and Beck site show two clutch kits for the Dolomite 1300

Part No.HK8917 Rover Part No. GCK160 size 182 OD years 01-1979 / 11-1980. Fits a range of cars including Dolomite 1500 and 1300

Part No.HK8930 Rover Part No.91132062 size 165 OD years - / 11-1980. Fits Toledo and Dolomite 1300s

Can see why the confusion. Acording to this one fits the whole production run, the other 79/80.

Think the only way forward is to find a local garage who will pull it out and check it, then order the replacement.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 4:32 pm 
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A true minefield.

The driven plate I took out of my car had/has a sticker on for 'National Auto Parts' , I have googled them and checked their site, they manufacture or refurbish clutch and other parts.

Usual disclaimer.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:21 pm 
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not sure when build date is on browny,,but logbook say reg date 11-7-1980 but i had same trouble working out which clutch it was til i took the gearbox out and measured up,,it the 7 1/4" 184mm

not sure on bsm car

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Dolomite 1300,1980`V`reg in british racing brown(russet),3.63 diff with 21t speedo pinion,95%poly`d,HL clocks,standard wheels with SE covers wrapt in 175 70 13,mot`d 19-09-2014,been off the since 1990,(july2017) stainless steel exhaust 3-piece.

Dolomite 1300,1977(tax free 1-1-1977),`R`reg in carmine red,bog standard including rust :shock: last time on road 6-2005


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:54 pm 
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Thanks Tam

I'm told the BSM cars all had the same 3 letters in the reg plates making them recognisable. I worked with a guy years ago who bought an ex BSM Escort which he wasn't aware of. First owner was an engineering company owned by BS M in name only to hide the cars history and make them more sellable when it was time to move them on. He found out when he came to trade it in and wasn't to pleased.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 12:31 pm 
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Just an update,

A friend who is a Spitfire fanatic has had a look at it and he thinks for now leave it alone. As was posted in replies to my other thread he believes it will last for a long time as it is. The clutch works fine and smoothly with smooth gear changes. He says after nearly 25 years its just bone dry around the fork lever assembly and thinks its the corragated sleve on the pin causing the noise. So thats what I am going to do and delay things untill necessary.


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