The Triumph Dolomite Club - Discussion Forum

My Mitsubishi Colt made a strange brief chattering noise a couple of times today and the clutch pedal became a bit juddery, so I drove it straight to my local garage where they diagnosed it as the clutch or the flywheel.
As I was puzled, the guy explained that modern cars have combined clutch and flywheel assemblies and "run through grease". What on earth does this mean? The only clutch I've ever changed was on a 1500HL. My car's not even that modern, it's on an 06 plate. Anybody got any experience of what he's on about?
Alan

Ah, the dreaded dual mass flywheel! Many years ago, Mr Borg and Mr Beck invented the friction clutch (if not them, then someone similar) The idea was so good that cars have used the same design for about 70 years. This design included springs in the drive plate to act as shock absorbers on take off.
Then a few years ago, some motor manufacturers looked at this design and thought " this is simple and effective and relatively cheap and easy to work on - we must do something about it!"
The result of their meddling is the dual mass flywheel and basically what it does is take the springs from the drive plate and put them into the (now two piece) flywheel, thereby making what was a lifetime part into a frequent (and expensive) service item which imparts little or no improvement to drive quality.

Now you know!

Steve

_________________
'73 2 door Toledo with Vauxhall Carlton 2.0 8v engine (The Carledo)
'78 Sprint Auto with Vauxhall Omega 2.2 16v engine (The Dolomega)
'72 Triumph 1500FWD in Slate Grey, Now with RWD and Carledo powertrain!

Maverick Triumph, Servicing, Repairs, Electrical, Recomissioning, MOT prep, Trackerjack brake fitting service.
Apprentice served Triumph Specialist for 50 years. PM for more info or quotes.

Thanks Steve. Do you ever get that feeling that you'd rather not know...

Hi Alan,
I have just had my first hands on experience of one of these on my daughters Audi A3. I have replaced it with an old style flywheel, plate, cover & new thrust bearing. The cost of the conversion kit was about half that of a replacement dual mass flywheel. Only real problem I had was getting access to the flywheel bolts as the one half of the flywheel had twisted and stuck with the access holes now out of line with the bolts. Half an hour with an angle grinder and cutting disc sorted it though.
Best of luck

Chris

DMF's are really designed to reduce unwanted transmission wear and also aid refinement. They also enable much better low speed driveability. I've known some people to swap out to a solid flywheel in Ford Focus and it's just made it drive and feel like a van.

Yes DMF's are a pain and expensive but cars are much nicer with them.

_________________
Mark

1961 Chevrolet Corvair Greenbrier Sportswagon
1980 Dolomite Sprint project using brand new shell
2009 Mazda MX5 2.0 Sport
2018 Infiniti Q30

I will admit that a DMF improves a diesel slightly but on petrol cars which run smoother at low revs the improvement is negligible.
Most of the Kidderminster Taxis are Toyota Avensis' These are all converted to solid flywheels as soon as the DMF fails and no drivers have complained even though they are driven all day every day and mostly in traffic.

Steve

_________________
'73 2 door Toledo with Vauxhall Carlton 2.0 8v engine (The Carledo)
'78 Sprint Auto with Vauxhall Omega 2.2 16v engine (The Dolomega)
'72 Triumph 1500FWD in Slate Grey, Now with RWD and Carledo powertrain!

Maverick Triumph, Servicing, Repairs, Electrical, Recomissioning, MOT prep, Trackerjack brake fitting service.
Apprentice served Triumph Specialist for 50 years. PM for more info or quotes.

A colleague of mine that used to work in the Post Office MT told me they just welded them up.

_________________
Trevor

75 Sprint in Magenta called GunGaDiN GGD944N
2017 Jaguar XE R-sport

I would be warry of putting a solid flywheel on a car designed for DMF. All the extra vibration could do damage elsewhere. They weren't designed for a solid flywheel.

When you fit the solid flywheel, you also change the clutch for one with springs in the drive plate. It's a complete package and designed for the job! I have seen a few DMFs welded up, its not easy to do it well enough to keep it in balance and there are no springs to cushion the drive shocks so drive plates and transmissions suffer early failures as well as making the clutch "agricultural" to say the least, the people I know who've done it have sold the vehicle on immediately.

Steve

_________________
'73 2 door Toledo with Vauxhall Carlton 2.0 8v engine (The Carledo)
'78 Sprint Auto with Vauxhall Omega 2.2 16v engine (The Dolomega)
'72 Triumph 1500FWD in Slate Grey, Now with RWD and Carledo powertrain!

Maverick Triumph, Servicing, Repairs, Electrical, Recomissioning, MOT prep, Trackerjack brake fitting service.
Apprentice served Triumph Specialist for 50 years. PM for more info or quotes.

My dad has just replaced the dmf on his Focus and showed me the old one earlier. It had totally failed with a huge amount of play in all directions. He's always been paranoid about it so had driven like a saint but clearly after 60k it's had enough regardless.

_________________
Mark

1961 Chevrolet Corvair Greenbrier Sportswagon
1980 Dolomite Sprint project using brand new shell
2009 Mazda MX5 2.0 Sport
2018 Infiniti Q30

I've changed a Focus (diesel) DMF at 35k and another at 170k. The low mileage one was a tidy and well cared for 1 owner example, the high mileage one was a thrashed and tatty shed -you do the math!
But a word to the wise, with a DMF equipped car it is very bad to sit in traffic in gear with the clutch depressed - something about overheating the DMF has been mentioned bringing on premature failure.
I drive a DMF equipped Zafira diesel on a weekly basis, I'm almost the only driver and the car is now on 172k and still on its original DMF (I know both owners from new) Even with me doing it, the owner would face a bill for about £1100 if it fails which would write the car off so I baby it!

Steve

_________________
'73 2 door Toledo with Vauxhall Carlton 2.0 8v engine (The Carledo)
'78 Sprint Auto with Vauxhall Omega 2.2 16v engine (The Dolomega)
'72 Triumph 1500FWD in Slate Grey, Now with RWD and Carledo powertrain!

Maverick Triumph, Servicing, Repairs, Electrical, Recomissioning, MOT prep, Trackerjack brake fitting service.
Apprentice served Triumph Specialist for 50 years. PM for more info or quotes.

Thanks for that, I'll change that aspect of my poor driving habits immediately.

Bug bear of mine- when the car is at rest apply the handbrake, very simple, handbrakes are far cheaper than clutches.

_________________
Trevor

75 Sprint in Magenta called GunGaDiN GGD944N
2017 Jaguar XE R-sport

Explains our company van, Merc Sprinter.
£1645+vat, new dmf, new clutch and sundries.

_________________
NRW 581W Sprint


On the motorway no one can hear me sing!
Construed as a public service, self preservation in reality.

And don't even THINK about holding it on the clutch on a hill!

This is one thing that a DMF does make easier, but if you value your wallet, DON'T DO IT!

Steve

_________________
'73 2 door Toledo with Vauxhall Carlton 2.0 8v engine (The Carledo)
'78 Sprint Auto with Vauxhall Omega 2.2 16v engine (The Dolomega)
'72 Triumph 1500FWD in Slate Grey, Now with RWD and Carledo powertrain!

Maverick Triumph, Servicing, Repairs, Electrical, Recomissioning, MOT prep, Trackerjack brake fitting service.
Apprentice served Triumph Specialist for 50 years. PM for more info or quotes.