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 Post subject: Vertical links Alloy?
PostPosted:Mon Jan 03, 2022 11:27 am 
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Can I ask if there were any aftermarket vertical links manufactured in alloy?

Seem to recall one time that someone had some made.

If not. Does anyone have any spare ones (for trackerjack conversion)


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PostPosted:Mon Jan 03, 2022 3:01 pm 
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I don't recall alloy versions, and don't think I'd like to rely on them to be frank, but NOS still available fairly reasonably from Rimmers here:

https://rimmerbros.com/Item--i-311449


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PostPosted:Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:40 am 
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This is something I’ve been thinking about for a little bit but not had the want or need to make a set of fabricated uprights, and I’m not confident enough to make them a commercial product.

I’ve already got some measurements to possibly start on a like-for-like copy of the uprights, but something I’m experimenting with is making a set of handed uprights which would be lighter still. There would also be scope to build-in a version of the Trackerjack kit so it wouldn’t need lugs cutting off.

Again, it’s very very early doors so I can’t guarantee anything at the moment, but this is where I’m currently up to:

Image

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PostPosted:Mon Jan 17, 2022 7:58 pm 
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Quote:
This is something I’ve been thinking about for a little bit but not had the want or need to make a set of fabricated uprights, and I’m not confident enough to make them a commercial product.

I’ve already got some measurements to possibly start on a like-for-like copy of the uprights, but something I’m experimenting with is making a set of handed uprights which would be lighter still. There would also be scope to build-in a version of the Trackerjack kit so it wouldn’t need lugs cutting off.

Again, it’s very very early doors so I can’t guarantee anything at the moment, but this is where I’m currently up to:

Image
I like the idea of the alloy upright,but when i fitted the trackerjack kit on my car i did cut one of the lugs off,but used one of the lugs on trackerjack kit to mount the disc back plate,i did have to remake the back plate for it to work

Dave


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PostPosted:Tue Jan 18, 2022 5:55 pm 
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how much do the upright weighs, is the weight saving worth all the work?

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PostPosted:Tue Jan 18, 2022 6:20 pm 
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Quote:
how much do the upright weighs, is the weight saving worth all the work?
The original Triumph ones weigh a fair bit!! more than I was expecting when I took them off, Maybe around 5kg but someone else will probably have better info.

Estimated for the one above was around 1kg

And it’s a reduction of unsprung mass which more effective

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PostPosted:Tue Jan 18, 2022 7:36 pm 
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Quote:
Quote:
how much do the upright weighs, is the weight saving worth all the work?
The original Triumph ones weigh a fair bit!! more than I was expecting when I took them off, Maybe around 5kg but someone else will probably have better info.

Estimated for the one above was around 1kg

And it’s a reduction of unsprung mass which more effective
Im using alloy front hubs on mine,theres a lot of difference in weight,ive also got bigger stub axle

Dave


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PostPosted:Thu Jan 20, 2022 10:21 am 
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
how much do the upright weighs, is the weight saving worth all the work?
The original Triumph ones weigh a fair bit!! more than I was expecting when I took them off, Maybe around 5kg but someone else will probably have better info.

Estimated for the one above was around 1kg

And it’s a reduction of unsprung mass which more effective
Im using alloy front hubs on mine,theres a lot of difference in weight,ive also got bigger stub axle

Dave
What’s the bigger stub axle? And I would have gone for the alloy Hulu a initially but I was cost limited at the time and the iron hubs were much cheaper than the alloy ones.

I do intend on going to alloy hubs when I can afford them.

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PostPosted:Thu Jan 20, 2022 9:09 pm 
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:


The original Triumph ones weigh a fair bit!! more than I was expecting when I took them off, Maybe around 5kg but someone else will probably have better info.

Estimated for the one above was around 1kg

And it’s a reduction of unsprung mass which more effective
Im using alloy front hubs on mine,theres a lot of difference in weight,ive also got bigger stub axle

Dave
What’s the bigger stub axle? And I would have gone for the alloy Hulu a initially but I was cost limited at the time and the iron hubs were much cheaper than the alloy ones.

I do intend on going to alloy hubs when I can afford them.
The bigger stub axle means less flex in the joint,know brake pad knock off,also it uses the same size wheel bearing front and back of the hub,how much i will really notice is hard to say its a road car not a race car :D :D :D

Dave


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PostPosted:Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:13 pm 
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Quote:
Quote:
how much do the upright weighs, is the weight saving worth all the work?
The original Triumph ones weigh a fair bit!! more than I was expecting when I took them off, Maybe around 5kg but someone else will probably have better info.

Estimated for the one above was around 1kg

And it’s a reduction of unsprung mass which more effective
I reckon its nearer 2-3 kgs. Got a pair on the bench now. Will try and weight them

For a alloy version, i wouldnt even consider it unless you can get an FEA analysis on it first. Certainly not if you sell them.

Id be surprised if there is enough money it though.

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1970 Triumph 2000 Estate w/ RV8
1980 Triumph Dolomite Sprint
2003 Holden Ss Ute
1969 Dodge Charger
1973 Triumph Stag
1961 Standard Atlas


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PostPosted:Sun Jan 23, 2022 1:07 pm 
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
how much do the upright weighs, is the weight saving worth all the work?
The original Triumph ones weigh a fair bit!! more than I was expecting when I took them off, Maybe around 5kg but someone else will probably have better info.

Estimated for the one above was around 1kg

And it’s a reduction of unsprung mass which more effective
I reckon its nearer 2-3 kgs. Got a pair on the bench now. Will try and weight them

For a alloy version, i wouldnt even consider it unless you can get an FEA analysis on it first. Certainly not if you sell them.

Id be surprised if there is enough money it though.
Maybe, I’m not amazing at guessing weights but around that seems about right. That including hub and stub axle? I can weigh those separately as I have my old set but I’d say it would add another kilo per side. Just looked it up and the iron Escort hubs weigh 2.25kg and the alloy ones weigh 1.4kg, so I’d assume that the iron Dolomite hubs weigh about the same. So a 40% weight saving there, maybe another 30-40% with alloy uprights, will definitely have an affect on the handling.

I’ve done some FEA on them, but I keep changing the design to suit manufacturability so I haven’t done one in a bit. I also need to work out what parameters I need to build to, like what kind of forces will be acting on them in worst case scenario (full bump etc.). I might get ahold of a spare hub to see what kind of load it would break at and design to that parameter. I think firstly, I’m going to 3D print one to check fitment and clearance.

Yes, I dont think it’s a smart venture commercially, which is why I was only really looking at them for myself and if anyone wants a set, I could provide the parts but maybe get someone else to weld them properly.

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PostPosted:Mon Jan 24, 2022 6:22 am 
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Your going to need to beef up the steering arm mounting points.
I know is only a drawing at this stage it is in need of much more strengthening.

Providing you copy the original mounting points and location of the original vertical upright.
There shouldn’t be any issues with bump steer ETC unless Triumph got it wrong to start with.


Large stub axle.
What are you guys using and from where.
Are these for Escort or Triumph hubs.

_________________
2009 Mini Clubman Cooper S Daily Driver.
1980 Dolomite Sprint with a touch of BLTS
Balanced Lightened and Tweaked 13B Rotary and SuperCharged.
Rebuilding the Sprint time taken so far, 111Hrs@15/12/2020
212Hrs @31/12/2021
249Hrs @ 07/04/2022
Member TDC no 0471

Project 13B Sprint now back on.


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PostPosted:Mon Jan 24, 2022 9:18 am 
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Doesn’t the GT6 provide a longer stub axle which fits?


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PostPosted:Mon Jan 24, 2022 9:44 am 
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Quote:
Your going to need to beef up the steering arm mounting points.
I know is only a drawing at this stage it is in need of much more strengthening.

Providing you copy the original mounting points and location of the original vertical upright.
There shouldn’t be any issues with bump steer ETC unless Triumph got it wrong to start with.


Large stub axle.
What are you guys using and from where.
Are these for Escort or Triumph hubs.
You mean the lower ball joint mount? Are these known for flexing or breaking? I’ll definitely consider it.

And I’d more than likely copy it so it’s a drop in part. I have looked at the triumph suspension to find out camber curves and caster angles but haven’t looked at bump steer yet as I haven’t had the time to model up the steering rack and subframe fully yet, I just have a half-ok representation of the suspension mounts and arms.

And this would be a direct replacement for the stock triumph upright. Which can be used with the Sprintspeed stub axles to use a Ford Escort RS hub, either alloy or iron. And I’d never heard of a larger bearing stub axle available for the Dolomite till someone here mentioned it so if the GT6 one works, I’d go with their knowledge and judgement. And seeing as the ST parts for the triumph seems to be just parts off other triumphs, I’d guess that it’s likely that the better hub axles would be GT6

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PostPosted:Mon Jan 24, 2022 10:21 am 
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Quote:
Quote:
Your going to need to beef up the steering arm mounting points.
I know is only a drawing at this stage it is in need of much more strengthening.

Providing you copy the original mounting points and location of the original vertical upright.
There shouldn’t be any issues with bump steer ETC unless Triumph got it wrong to start with.


Large stub axle.
What are you guys using and from where.
Are these for Escort or Triumph hubs.
You mean the lower ball joint mount? Are these known for flexing or breaking? I’ll definitely consider it.

And I’d more than likely copy it so it’s a drop in part. I have looked at the triumph suspension to find out camber curves and caster angles but haven’t looked at bump steer yet as I haven’t had the time to model up the steering rack and subframe fully yet, I just have a half-ok representation of the suspension mounts and arms.

And this would be a direct replacement for the stock triumph upright. Which can be used with the Sprintspeed stub axles to use a Ford Escort RS hub, either alloy or iron. And I’d never heard of a larger bearing stub axle available for the Dolomite till someone here mentioned it so if the GT6 one works, I’d go with their knowledge and judgement. And seeing as the ST parts for the triumph seems to be just parts off other triumphs, I’d guess that it’s likely that the better hub axles would be GT6
Yes I meant the Lower Ball Joint/Steering arm.
I haven’t heard of any breaking.

It just looks like you need more support around these points.

Billet alloy would be the best and strongest to machine from but not the cheapest.
Are you machining the final part.

Image

_________________
2009 Mini Clubman Cooper S Daily Driver.
1980 Dolomite Sprint with a touch of BLTS
Balanced Lightened and Tweaked 13B Rotary and SuperCharged.
Rebuilding the Sprint time taken so far, 111Hrs@15/12/2020
212Hrs @31/12/2021
249Hrs @ 07/04/2022
Member TDC no 0471

Project 13B Sprint now back on.


Last edited by SprintV8 on Mon Jan 24, 2022 11:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

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