The Triumph Dolomite Club - Discussion Forum

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2020 7:52 pm 
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I've just bought a replacement set of seats for Mrs Weevil's Mini as all the foam in the originals has hopelessly collapsed. The replacement set came from a car 20 years younger than the originals and have a release knob on the side - some kind of latch to hold the seats down, pull to tilt forwards. The originals just stay put under a) gravity and b) seatbelts which to me seems ample. The extra 2 or 3 kilo of mass in my back 'crushing' my rib cage against the seat belt in the event of a crash seems insignificant.
Anyway, MOT rules are generally of the sort that if it's there it must work. Would that apply here? If so must I install the floor catch for the mechanism to work with with or can I simply remove the pull knob leaving just an inconspicuous hole in the seat side? The obvious give away that the replacement seats are from a later car are the headrests. that and you don't need a chiropractors help to get out of the car.

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1978 Pageant Sprint - the rustomite, 1972 Spitfire IV - sprintfire project, 1968 Valencia GT6 II - little Blue, 1980 Vermillion 1500HL - resting. 1974 Sienna 1500TC, Mrs Weevils big brown.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2020 8:52 pm 
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I doubt there is actually a reg for this. Seats in 2 door cars, the tilt MUST work, a fault in the lock mech preventing it will earn you a fail. I've fallen foul of this one myself on a mkII Fiesta. But if the original seat didn't lock down, I doubt they could fail it if the replacement doesn't. Even so, were it mine, i'd delete the lock mechanism from the new seats. Just to be on the (un)safe side!

At the very least it will save a protracted discussion!

Steve

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'73 2 door Toledo with Vauxhall Carlton 2.0 8v engine (The Carledo)
'78 Sprint Auto with Vauxhall Omega 2.2 16v engine (The Dolomega)
'72 Triumph 1500FWD in Slate Grey

Maverick Triumph, Servicing, Repairs, Electrical, Recomissioning, MOT prep, Trackerjack brake fitting service.
Apprentice served Triumph Specialist for 50 years. PM for more info or quotes.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 26, 2020 9:51 am 
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Location: Sutton,Surrey.
Found the documents

6.2.5. Driver’s seat
You do not need to check that the driver’s seat can be secured in all possible positions. For electrically adjusted seats, you do not need to check that any ‘memory position’ function is working.

Defect Category
(a) A driver’s seat:

(i) with a defective structure
(ii) insecure

Major
Dangerous
(b) A driver’s seat:

(i) fore and aft adjustment mechanism not working as intended
(ii) seat moving inadvertently or backrest cannot be retained in the upright position

Major
Dangerous


I personally would find the latch attachment that goes on the floor so the seat is secure.
From memory it’s like a U bracket.

Hi

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2005 Mercedes C Class V6 Diesel Turbo Daily Driver.
1980 Dolomite Sprint with a touch of BLTS
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Project 13B Sprint now on hold.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 2:56 pm 
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Thanks. Mechanism removed & seats fitted. Common sense suggests it should be fine, the car was built without seat latches so is correct to original spec. Common sense doesn't always win the day however.

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1978 Pageant Sprint - the rustomite, 1972 Spitfire IV - sprintfire project, 1968 Valencia GT6 II - little Blue, 1980 Vermillion 1500HL - resting. 1974 Sienna 1500TC, Mrs Weevils big brown.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 9:11 pm 
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Quote:
I doubt there is actually a reg for this. Seats in 2 door cars, the tilt MUST work, a fault in the lock mech preventing it will earn you a fail.
Not true, sorry. Theres no fail for the tilt mechanism, it does not need to work for access to the rear seats.

All thats tested is the fore-aft adjustment and the secure mounting of the seat to the car and security of the backrest. On a Mini, the entire seat tips for access to the rear, its hinged at the front. As the seatbelt mounts to the car, not the seat, the belt will hold both the occupant and seat in place. Perfectly safe and MOT worthy.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 9:28 pm 
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Location: Highley, Shropshire
Quote:
Quote:
I doubt there is actually a reg for this. Seats in 2 door cars, the tilt MUST work, a fault in the lock mech preventing it will earn you a fail.
Not true, sorry. Theres no fail for the tilt mechanism, it does not need to work for access to the rear seats.

All thats tested is the fore-aft adjustment and the secure mounting of the seat to the car and security of the backrest. On a Mini, the entire seat tips for access to the rear, its hinged at the front. As the seatbelt mounts to the car, not the seat, the belt will hold both the occupant and seat in place. Perfectly safe and MOT worthy.
I've HAD a 2 door Fiesta fail on the tilt lock not working! Not THAT recently I admit, but within the time of computerised MOTs. I also removed the Carledo's back seat on advice from my tame tester for the same reason, i'd fitted fixed front seats. Not that you could get into the back without a big struggle anyway! But no back seat fitted, no tilt required.

I'd thought when I got the MGF seats that they would tilt and allow the back seat to be refitted, turns out they don't tilt, except in the sense you can slide them forward and wind the recliner forward well past vertical with the knob on the side. Not much good in an emergency exit situation! Which I gather is the thinking behind the tilt needing to work!

Steve

_________________
'73 2 door Toledo with Vauxhall Carlton 2.0 8v engine (The Carledo)
'78 Sprint Auto with Vauxhall Omega 2.2 16v engine (The Dolomega)
'72 Triumph 1500FWD in Slate Grey

Maverick Triumph, Servicing, Repairs, Electrical, Recomissioning, MOT prep, Trackerjack brake fitting service.
Apprentice served Triumph Specialist for 50 years. PM for more info or quotes.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2020 9:45 pm 
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The MOT manual is online, go read it.
If you can't find a fail for the tilt release mech then I can't fail it.
Im not sure what your Fiesta failed on... but it should not have done.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2020 3:56 pm 
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Quote:
The MOT manual is online, go read it.
If you can't find a fail for the tilt release mech then I can't fail it.
Im not sure what your Fiesta failed on... but it should not have done.
It failed because the cable conncting the handle to the tilt lock mechanism had broken, ergo the seat couldn't be tipped to access or exit the rear seat (drivers side only faulty, the passenger one worked fine) I can't remember the exact wording, the fail (and the car) are long gone. But a new cable from Ford at around £3.50 and a couple of hours to fit it was OK with me. I was GIVEN the car, this and a track rod end were all it had failed on. Made good money IIRC.

I can see the point, truthfully i'd regard this as MORE important than if the slider works correctly, most owner only driven cars (ie MOST cars) the slider is never moved from 1 year to the next (the testability of this function IS a newish addition) If you say the tilt lock isn't in the regs anymore, I believe you. It seems daft to me to drop it (pretty sure it DID exist at some time) but when have MOT regs made much sense?

Steve

_________________
'73 2 door Toledo with Vauxhall Carlton 2.0 8v engine (The Carledo)
'78 Sprint Auto with Vauxhall Omega 2.2 16v engine (The Dolomega)
'72 Triumph 1500FWD in Slate Grey

Maverick Triumph, Servicing, Repairs, Electrical, Recomissioning, MOT prep, Trackerjack brake fitting service.
Apprentice served Triumph Specialist for 50 years. PM for more info or quotes.


Last edited by Carledo on Sat Aug 29, 2020 4:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2020 4:01 pm 
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Your missing the point.
A simple question has been asked - is it a fail?
Simple answer is No.
Any mistake made by your Tame MOT Tester at some point in the past is irrelevant. Its still NOT a fail able item, nor ever has been.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:27 am 
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I had an mot fail once due to the sealed beam headlights on my dolomite not having the expected euro beam pattern, I couldn't be bothered to find the british american exemption so fitted some vastly superior skoda estelle headlightwhich solved the none problem.

Some testers dont know old tat and I dont begrudge them that as old cars are generally full of unexpectedly accepted bad ideas!


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