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PostPosted: Wed May 04, 2022 8:17 pm 
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I know they may not be for the purists but I put a set of Nankang Ultra Sport NS-2
195/60 R13 83H on my Sprint last year.

I don’t do track days and the car does not hit more than 70mph during normal driving.

They do the job well, low road noise and fit the rims perfectly.

Richard.

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PostPosted: Thu May 05, 2022 12:27 am 
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Since when is wear a parameter?

Jeroen
WEAR has always been a PARAMETER so far as I am concerned! Not everyone has unlimited funds to run a motor vehicle and buying a complete set of five or six tyres (i.e. one or two spares), once every 6~10 years, is quite frequent enough for me! :shock: :cry:

The six Michelin XZX 185 SR14 Reinforced radial tyres (two spares) that my father had fitted in circa 1977/78 (a mere 43~45 years ago) to our 1973 VW "1600" Type 2 Westfalia Continental motor-caravan, still appear to be in good condition, but I shall give them a thorough inspection and low-speed trial before I contemplate re-using them. :wink:
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The TR7 Sprint was supposed to top out at 120, with 0-60 in 8.5. They are the same as the specs for the 135bhp US TR8. But I don't know if the TR8 was 135 SAE or 135 DIN. Where I know the Dolomite Sprint was 135 SAE, but only 127 DIN. This does imply that German horses are stronger than American ones, but I'm not sure that's true. Perhaps they are just encouraged more efficiently.

But the TR7's plaid cloth seats may be an issue in driving it to 120 mph, as the stains will never come out.

As to how many horses to go how fast - if it's limited by aerodynamics, so rolling resistances can be ignored, and ignoring ground effect (cos the maths is too hard), it should take 8 times as many horses to make the same shape car go twice as fast: Power = Force x Velocity (Power = Work / Time; Work = Force x Distance; Velocity = Distance / Time). So 4 times the force (drag being proportional to V squared) moving at twice the V.

Graham
Well the 0-60 of 8.5 is close or the same as that widely advertised for the Dolomite Sprint in the UK. Non emasculated UK Tr8s (not that there were many) running on carbs probably shoved out a bit more, that V8 engine in the P6B was rated at 155bhp (DIN) slightly less in the worse breathing but much lighter MGBGTV8. But the TR7 Sprint (as a hardtop as they all were) is clearly a much cleaner shape aerodynamically so, along with a tad less weight, a V-max of 120 is a fairly reasonable assumption. The same engine in a convertible would probably struggle to make over 100mph top down or maybe 105 top up. That was my experience with my GT6 convertible in the 80s, from experiments conducted in the same place in the same car on the same day. With the (nothing special aerodynamically) Spitfire hardtop on, it showed me a true V-max of 117mph, (a "proper" GT6 MkII with the sloping tail was supposed to top out at 120) with the hardtop removed and the soft top errected it could only make 104mph where you'd think the weight loss would make it faster and top down it REALLY didn't even want to make the ton, I reckon 98 was about it's lot!

Which matches all i've learned about aero. Aerodynamic drag doesn't seem to increase linearly (is that a word?) but in a curve which is like the reverse of an engine power curve, where an engine starts off on a steep curve which tapers off towards the top, a drag curve starts off shallow and doesn't seem to really climb to significance until around 80 mph. Till, on a stock Sprint, by 110 or thereabouts, it's near vertical. Sure, with enough extra power you can overcome this resistance, you just pay the price in fuel consumption. As you so correctly pointed out, the engine needs to work harder the faster you go, it can only work so hard at max power output which gives you a V-max for any given engine in any given car shape, where power output exactly equals aero drag. Other parasitic losses are tiny by comparison , so I'm ignoring them! Add more power and the V-max will rise but the engine needs more fuel to make that extra power so fuel consumption rises, also by that 4x figure unless i've done my sums wrong. Certainly it's much more than a linear progression anyway. It's a big part of why the average car is so much more economical at 60mph than at 90, at 60, the drag curve is still fairly flat whereas at 90 it's much steeper.

Lousy as the Sprint's aero is, it could be worse! When first built, at standard Toledo ride height and sans the standard chin spoiler, the Carledo was "nervous" at 80mph or more. Dropping it an inch and a half and adding that chin spoiler made a surprisingly big difference to high speed stability.

So, in one way, by picking a Dolomite to make quicker, i'm starting in the wrong place, I should choose a body shape that is much cleaner aerodynamically. But I LIKE the shape so i'll live with it! In any case, plod will take your licence if they catch you at over a ton so, whether my V-max is 120 or 150, is really irrelevant!

As far as tyres go, even when on a trackday at Castle Coombe, there's only one spot where I can touch 100 mph before braking hard for the next corner, so from a purely tyre safety point of view, I could manage comfortably on T or even the the now nearly obsolete S rated tyres and the V raters i'm using are a bit overkill!

Steve
Not only does the engine have to develop more power to overcome aerodynamic drag (proportional to the air's relative velocity squared) but with increasing speed one also needs greater additional power (in addition to that needed to overcome rolling resistance, aerodynamic drag and change in gravitational potential energy when climbing a gradient, no matter how slight!) to maintain the same degree of acceleration, which is equal to the product of speed x acceleration x mass, which one can deduce by differentiating kinetic energy E = ½mv² with respect to time, using either the chain rule or product rule of differentiation.
But what degree of acceleration is there when at top speed?

Graham

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Factory 1977 TR7 Sprint FHC VVC 697S (Now all of, but still needs putting together)
B&Y 73 Dolomite Sprint UVB 274M (kids!)
1970 Maroon 13/60 Herald Convertable (wife's fun car).


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PostPosted: Fri May 06, 2022 6:55 pm 
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But what degree of acceleration is there when at top speed?

Graham

Once one has reached the maximum attainable road-speed, the degree of acceleration is ZERO, because there is no additional reserve power available at that engine-speed & road-speed, to further increase the road-speed!

One might be able to increase the maximum attainable speed, by altering the overall effective engine gearing (dependent upon gear-ratio, final-drive-ratio & tyre external-circumference) if the vehicle is either "over-geared" or "under-geared" and/or by increasing the performance of the engine.

"Optimal-gearing" is defined as being when the maximum attainable road-speed is achieved at the road-speed corresponding to having reached maximum power. Hence, the greatest attainable maximum speed requires that the vehicle has "optimal-gearing" and so being either"over-geared" or "under-geared", will result in having a lesser maximum attainable speed.

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PostPosted: Fri May 06, 2022 8:06 pm 
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But what degree of acceleration is there when at top speed?

Graham

Once one has reached the maximum attainable road-speed, the degree of acceleration is ZERO, because there is no additional reserve power available at that engine-speed & road-speed, to further increase the road-speed!

One might be able to increase the maximum attainable speed, by altering the overall effective engine gearing (dependent upon gear-ratio, final-drive-ratio & tyre external-circumference) if the vehicle is either "over-geared" or "under-geared" and/or by increasing the performance of the engine.

"Optimal-gearing" is defined as being when the maximum attainable road-speed is achieved at the road-speed corresponding to having reached maximum power. Hence, the greatest attainable maximum speed requires that the vehicle has "optimal-gearing" and so being either"over-geared" or "under-geared", will result in having a lesser maximum attainable speed.
In which case, why bring up the analysis of acceleration in the context of how much more power is needed to go at twice the top speed then?

Graham

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The 16v Slant 4 engine is more fun than the 3.5 V8, because you mostly drive it on the upslope of the torque curve.

Factory 1977 TR7 Sprint FHC VVC 697S (Now all of, but still needs putting together)
B&Y 73 Dolomite Sprint UVB 274M (kids!)
1970 Maroon 13/60 Herald Convertable (wife's fun car).


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2022 7:08 pm 
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In which case, why bring up the analysis of acceleration in the context of how much more power is needed to go at twice the top speed then?

Graham

I suspect Graham, that you might have missed the point! For any given speed, no matter how slow or fast, one needs twice as much reserve power to obtain the same degree of acceleration, when travelling at twice that given speed.

As a vehicle’s road-speed increases, the maximum power that can be developed by the engine at a given corresponding engine speed, is dictated by gear ratios, final-drive ratio and tyre’s external circumference. At a given road speed, varying proportions of that power, are each requiring to overcome (a) rolling resistance, (b) aerodynamic drag, and (c) hill-climbing resistance. Any remaining unallocated power capability, can be used for acceleration (i.e. increasing a vehicle’s road-speed and its associated kinetic energy).

However as the road-speed (m/s) increases, so the extent of unallocated power available for acceleration [m/s² = (m/s)/s] tends to diminish, because the demands of (a), (b) & (c) increase with road-speed (m/s) and this probably increases more rapidly than the total power output of the engine as engine speed increases. Not only has the available power diminished as road-speed (m/s) increased, but the amount of power needed to achieve the same degree of acceleration [m/s²] increases in proportion to the road-speed (m/s).

Recall that the power for acceleration, P = speed x acceleration x mass; most conveniently expressed in the metric S.I. system of units, with power P in W or kW, speed v in m/s, mass m in kg and acceleration a in m/s². Recall that for a skydiver in free-fall, the initial acceleration due to gravity is approximately 9•81 m/s² (also a car’s theoretical maximum braking deceleration), gradually diminishing to zero at “terminal-velocity” as descent-speed increases, owing to increasing aerodynamic drag.

Hence for a car of 1 tonne = 1000 kg mass, accelerating at 1 m/s², at a speed of 5 m/s (i.e. 18 km/h = 11•25 mph), P = 1000 x 1 x 5 = 5 kW

Hence for a car of 1 tonne = 1000 kg mass, accelerating at 1 m/s², at a speed of 10 m/s (i.e. 36 km/h = 22•5 mph), P = 1000 x 1 x 10 = 10 kW

Hence for a car of 1 tonne = 1000 kg mass, accelerating at 1 m/s², at a speed of 15 m/s (i.e. 54 km/h = 33•75 mph), P = 1000 x 1 x 15 = 15 kW

Hence for a car of 1 tonne = 1000 kg mass, accelerating at 1 m/s², at a speed of 20 m/s (i.e. 72 km/h = 45•0 mph), P = 1000 x 1 x 20 = 20 kW

Hence for a car of 1 tonne = 1000 kg mass, accelerating at 1 m/s², at a speed of 25 m/s (i.e. 90 km/h = 56•25 mph – fast enough for New Zealand roads! – ideal cruising speed for Triumph Toledo 13/1500!), P = 1000 x 1 x 25 = 25 kW

Hence for a car of 1 tonne = 1000 kg mass, accelerating at 1 m/s², at a speed of 30 m/s (i.e. 108 km/h = 67•5 mph – too fast for New Zealand roads!), P = 1000 x 1 x 30 = 30 kW

Hence for a car of 1 tonne = 1000 kg mass, accelerating at 1 m/s², at a speed of 35 m/s (i.e. 116 km/h = 78•75 mph – more than fast enough for British roads!), P = 1000 x 1 x 35 = 35 kW

Hence for a car of 1 tonne = 1000 kg mass, accelerating at 1 m/s², at a speed of 40 m/s (i.e. 144 km/h = 90•0 mph), P = 1000 x 1 x 40 = 40 kW

Assume a Dolomite Sprint of circa 900 kg mass (would be much more than this, with a driver & three passengers, averaging 65 kg each, plus luggage) were able to maintain a constant acceleration (which no car can do!) from rest to 60 mph = 96 km/h = 26•66 … m/s in 8•5 seconds.

The average acceleration would equal (26•66 … – 0) / 8•5 = 3•137 m/s²

Average Power, Pav = mechanical work done to increase kinetic energy, E = ½mv² / time taken

Hence, Pav = 0•5 x 900 x 26•66 … x 26•66 … / 8•5 = 37•65 kW

Peak power at peak-power engine speed is often only relevant in the lower gears, and usually for top gear is a separate issue, that forms part of the discussion re “under-gearing”, “optimal-gearing” & “over-gearing”, which will affect the vehicle’s greatest attainable maximum road-speed.

To reliably predict a car’s maximum attainable road-speed even under non-windy conditions, and its acceleration & hill-climbing abilities, one would need precise, accurate information about the following things:

• Overall mass, including mass of driver, passengers, luggage, fuel & oil etc;
• Aerodynamic drag coefficient
• Projected frontal area
• Rolling resistance characteristics
• Power & torque versus rpm characteristics of the engine
• Efficiency re mechanical losses of the drive train
• Gear ratios, final-drive ratio & tyre external circumference

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Nigel A. Skeet

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Upgraded 1974 Triumph Toledo 1300 (Toledo / Dolomite HL / Sprint hybrid)

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2022 7:14 pm 
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In late-1987, I fitted French-made, T-rated, 185/70 R13 Firestone S211 M+S tyres to my 1974 Triumph Toledo 1300, on the 5.5 x 13 inch Cosmic alloy wheels (21 mm offset), which were later transferred to the substitute 5.5 x 13 inch Dolomite Sprint wheels (35 mm offset). Rated up to a maximum of 118 mph, they were rather over-rated for by my 58 bhp Toledo, but I could not find and any S-rated tyres by then! Owing to premature wear of the two front tyres attributable to a toe-in misalignment, I needed to replace them with South African made, T-rated S-rated, 185/70 R13 Firestone S211 M+S tyres in circa 1995. They were all still in fine fettle in mid-1999, with plenty of tread remaining, when I laid-up the car in mid-1999.

I cannot presently recall (it's probably documented in my DIY service records!) the average mileage covered by each of these 185/70 R13 Firestone S211 M+S tyres, but each of my previous set of five Kelly-Springfield Steelmark, 175 SR13 (i.e. 175/80 R13) tyres on the Cosmic wheels, lasted more than 35,000 miles of road use, from early-1982 to late-1987, before I replaced them at circa 2•5 mm tread-depth.
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Since when is wear a parameter?

Jeroen
Quote:
WEAR has always been a PARAMETER so far as I am concerned! Not everyone has unlimited funds to run a motor vehicle and buying a complete set of five or six tyres (i.e. one or two spares), once every 6~10 years, is quite frequent enough for me!

Excluding “boy-racer” types such as Jeroen, for whom tyre-replacement frequency & cost seems to be irrelevant, so long as they provide the grip to enable one to negotiate sharp bends at excessive break-neck speeds (that would probably incur a “dangerous-driving” charge on British roads, assuming one survived the experience!), I found some interesting links on a North American website, which gives details of some well-known brands of tyres, that have tyre tread-wear warranties, albeit over a limited time duration, typically ranging between 60,000 and 80,000 miles for all-season tyres, which seems very encouraging to me!

https://www.edmunds.com/auto-warranty/u ... nties.html

https://rimrubber.com/tyre-warranties/# ... ears%20out.

https://www.consumerreports.org/cro/tir ... to-useless

https://tiresize.com/

Pirelli P4 Four-Seasons Plus, 185/60 R15 90,000 mile tread-wear warranty | T, H or V rated |

https://tiresize.com/tires/Pirelli/P4-F ... s-Plus.htm

Falken Sincera SN250 A/S | T rated - 80,000 mile tread-wear warranty | H or V rated - 75,000 mile tread-wear warranty

https://tiresize.com/tires/Falken/Sincera-SN250-AS.htm

Kumho Solus TA11 | 75,000 mile tread-wear warranty

https://tiresize.com/tires/Kumho/Solus-TA11.htm

Toyo Extensa A/S II | T & H rated - 75,000 mile tread-wear warranty | V rated - 65,000 mile tread-wear warranty

https://tiresize.com/tires/Toyo/Extensa-AS-II.htm

Toyo Celcius | 60,000 mile tread-wear warranty

https://tiresize.com/tires/Toyo/Celsius.htm

Cooper Trendsetter SE | 40,000 mile tread-wear warranty

https://tiresize.com/tires/Cooper/Trendsetter-SE.htm

I would be extremely disappointed, if I don’t manage to obtain at least 35,000 miles, if not a lot more service life, from each tyre, of my next set of five or six tyres (i.e. one or two spares), on the 5½J x 15 inch, MG 2000 Maestro alloy wheels (31 mm wheel-offset), for my 1974 Triumph Toledo 1300 “HL Special”!

The Kumho Solus TA11 has a tread-wear warranty limit of 75,000 miles, and these tyres are currently still available in sizes such as 185/70 R13, which is what I presently have on my existing 5½J x 13 inch alloy wheels. In general, the choice of 185/70 R13 size tyres is becoming progressively more limited, and this website lists only three options, which are of Kumho, Cooper & Ironman brands; the last of which offers no tread-wear mileage warranty! Even for the more commonly used 175/70 R13 tyre size, there is only a choice of six tyres and all of those are T rated for speed.

https://tiresize.com/tiresizes/175-70R13.htm

https://tiresize.com/tiresizes/175-70R13.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/Ironman/GR906-175-70R13.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/Ironman/RB-12-175-70R13.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/Hankook/Kine ... -70R13.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/Kumho/Solus- ... -70R13.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/Uniroyal/Tig ... -70R13.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/General/Alti ... -70R13.htm

https://tiresize.com/tiresizes/185-70R13.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/Kumho/Solus- ... -70R13.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/Cooper/Trend ... -70R13.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/Ironman/GR906-185-70R13.htm

The Pirelli P4 Four-Seasons Plus tyre, has a tread-wear warranty limit of 90,000 miles, and these tyres are available in sizes such as 185/60 R15 & 185/65 R15, that are suitable for my substitute 5½J x 15 inch alloy wheels.

https://tiresize.com/tiresizes/175-60R15.htm

https://tiresize.com/tiresizes/175-55R15.htm

https://tiresize.com/tiresizes/175-65R15.htm

https://tiresize.com/tiresizes/185-55R15.htm

https://tiresize.com/tiresizes/185-60R15.htm

https://tiresize.com/tiresizes/185-65R15.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/Pirelli/P4-F ... -60R15.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/Pirelli/P4-F ... -65R15.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/Falken/Since ... -55R15.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/Toyo/Extensa ... -60R15.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/Toyo/Extensa ... -65R15.htm

For anyone using 5½J x 14 inch wheels (e.g. Austin-Rover Montego 2000 TD wheels or MG-F & MG-TF space-saver wheels), there are various options in 175/65 R14 or 185/65 R14 tyre sizes, including the Toyo Extensa A/S II, with its 75,000 mile tread-wear warranty limit for T & H rated tyres.

https://tiresize.com/tiresizes/175-65R15.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/Toyo/Extensa ... -65R14.htm

https://tiresize.com/tiresizes/185-65R15.htm

https://tiresize.com/tires/Toyo/Extensa ... -65R14.htm

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Nigel A. Skeet

Independent tutor of mathematics, physics, technology & engineering, for secondary, tertiary, further & higher education.

https://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=308177758

Upgraded 1974 Triumph Toledo 1300 (Toledo / Dolomite HL / Sprint hybrid)

Onetime member + magazine editor & technical editor of Volkswagen Type 2 Owners' Club


Last edited by naskeet on Mon Jul 11, 2022 8:28 pm, edited 8 times in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2022 7:16 pm 
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Jeroen you Boy Racer :x
Anyone contemplating using 45 year old Michelins on the road requires re-programming.....


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2022 8:00 pm 
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Jeroen you Boy Racer :x

Anyone contemplating using 45 year old Michelins on the road requires re-programming.....

Michelin XZX, 185 SR14 Reinforced tyres have proved to be very durable and were still in fine fettle in late-1992, just 14 or 15 years after they were fitted in 1977/78. :D They certainly proved their worth driving around northern, eastern, southern & western Europe, as well as Great Britain & Ireland. I've heard that one can commonly get about 60,000+ miles of use out of them. 8)

https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/michel ... s/xzx.html

The XZX was the progression of the earlier Michelin ZX. The XZX was developed in 1976

https://www.michelin.co.uk/classic/tyres/michelin-xzx

https://www.michelin.co.uk/auto/car-tyre-sizes

https://dcadprod.azureedge.net/b2c-expe ... ook-en.pdf

Sadly, the much younger Firestone S211, 185/70 R13 85T tyres, fitted in 1987 & 1995 are not so durable with regard to ageing! :cry:

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Nigel A. Skeet

Independent tutor of mathematics, physics, technology & engineering, for secondary, tertiary, further & higher education.

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Upgraded 1974 Triumph Toledo 1300 (Toledo / Dolomite HL / Sprint hybrid)

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2022 9:48 am 
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The vast majority of our cars (dolomites / toledos) today, let’s face it are used as toys. Very few are pressed into daily service (365 days a year) and consequently tyres, their age, even if they’re not worn is a major consideration.

It may be dismissed as a ploy for increasing sales, but the recommendations from the industry as a whole is to replace every 5 to 7 years regardless of mileage, due to the possible degradation of the tyre compound.

I can see their point, they’re what’s keeping you on the road. They’re the possible difference between stopping or having an accident.
Tyres always have been, and will continue to be an area, where cost while still important, money will not be scrimped and saved and the “best” option, whether that be a OEM fit, a recommendation from a magazine tyre test, or from a group such as this, will always be taken.

I’ve just replaced the tyres on my sprint alloys - due to their age, 10 years, and probably 2000 miles, as I’m thinking about putting them back on the car. I felt it was prudent to do so as the risk of problems due to their age is high, not just to me but other road users.

The thought of using tyres any older, and 45 years old to be honest, beggars belief, regardless of condition.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2022 8:31 am 
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Excluding “boy-racer” types such as Jeroen, for whom tyre-replacement frequency & cost seems to be irrelevant, so long as they provide the grip to enable one to negotiate sharp bends at excessive break-neck speeds (that would probably incur a “dangerous-driving” charge on British roads, assuming one survived the experience!), I found some interesting links on a North American website, which gives details of some well-known brands of tyres, that have tyre tread-wear warranties, albeit over a limited time duration, typically ranging between 60,000 and 80,000 miles for all-season tyres, which seems very encouraging to me!
I'm a family man and it's to keep the family safe. All cars have Falkens as these have a lot of grip and do their job in the wet very good way above avarage. Actually the best I have ever driven and in my career I tried and experienced a lot of different makes over the years.

The now gone Corolla but also the Dolomites tend to understeer in the wet, especially on roundabouts or sharp corners. The Falkens are the first that didn't slide and after fitting all cars with these all have improved significantly.

On the daily Corolla they did last about 20.000 - 25.000km what I don't mind. On the daily Dolomite I will measure. That one has covered around 10.000km on Falkens now.

Jeroen

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2022 12:47 pm 
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Another vote for Falkens. Fitted them to my wifes MX5 and daughters 107. And will be fitting a set to the dolomite once it returns to the road. Yes, soft compound, but wet grip is amazing, and as good as anything else in the dry.

The sooner it becomes law that tyres have to be under 7 years old the better.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2022 1:05 pm 
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Falkens for me any day of the week and it's not like they are expensive compared to the massive objects fitted to most moderns.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2022 2:55 pm 
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ive got on my 1300 daily (only car) avon zt5 all round,,can`t fault them,good in dry and wet..but each to there own brand

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Dolomite 1300,1980`V`reg in british racing brown(russet),3.63 diff with 21t speedo pinion,95%poly`d,HL clocks,standard wheels with SE covers wrapt in 175 70 13,mot`d 19-09-2014,been off the since 1990,(july2017) stainless steel exhaust 3-piece,(xmas2018) wooden mountney steering wheel,(june2020) new monroe shock(radial front,gas-matic rears) with -1" lower`d springs all round.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2022 2:57 pm 
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Future Club member hopefully!
Future Club member hopefully!

Joined: Wed Oct 23, 2013 8:10 pm
Posts: 760
Location: NORTH NOTTS
The sooner it becomes law that tyres have to be under 7 years old the better.
[/quote]
who`s going to police it?

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Dolomite 1300,1980`V`reg in british racing brown(russet),3.63 diff with 21t speedo pinion,95%poly`d,HL clocks,standard wheels with SE covers wrapt in 175 70 13,mot`d 19-09-2014,been off the since 1990,(july2017) stainless steel exhaust 3-piece,(xmas2018) wooden mountney steering wheel,(june2020) new monroe shock(radial front,gas-matic rears) with -1" lower`d springs all round.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2022 4:20 pm 
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TDC Member

Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 7:26 am
Posts: 2485
Quote:
The sooner it becomes law that tyres have to be under 7 years old the better.
who`s going to police it?
[/quote]

Simple, MoT, plus simple advert/media. Make it crystal clear, and get some of the hopelessly maintained mot exempt cars checked properly. Make people pay a bit more attention.

_________________
Clive Senior
Brighton


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