Anti-roll bar ends

[misterp]

Hi folks,

While Im waiting for my UNC helicoil set to arrive so I can repair the cam cover problem, Im doing a few other jobs.

One of them is to give the suspension a once over and check everything.
Ive decided to replace the top balljoints as there is a little bit of play, and the gaitors are well past it, but the ARB end bushes are non-existent.

It seems that Jigsaw, Rimmer Bros sell sets, as well as superflex but all very expensive.

Ive read a few posts where people have spoken about re-bushing the rubber or poly inserts themselves, but never seemed to go any further.

So..firstly, does anyone have any success stories with DIY?
Secondly, Ive ordered a block or 50mm thick EPDM rubber (for all of $10), measured the fittings (30mm ID, 35mm length, and 12mm hole) and will see if I cant make a bush a push it home. Shouldnt be too difficult to make with a suitably sized hole saw, a jubilee clip to act as a compressor and a length of rod and washers to pull it home.

I`ll try to post a pic and details of success or failure if anyone is interested?

Cheers

Andrew

[Toledo Man]

I would get the Super Flex ones without a moment's hesitation. The one from Jigsaw are made by Polybush.

[sjb2oak]

I've had a go at making my own poly ones, they're slightly larger and harder than standard but I think they should work.
I haven't try them yet because the rest of the car is still in bits.
Good luck with yours.

poly3.jpg (139.72 KiB) Viewed 2446 times

[tony g]

Looks a nice job, let us know how it works out

Tony

[soe8m]

Probably they are broken within 1000km. This is the only part of the suspension what needs a soft bush. It is a not so good well though design. Normally on all the other cars you have a link between the lower arm and stabi rod so very flexible and rotational by two turning points per side. If you do not want it to be so flexible you use two rose joints. Still rotational every way round at any angle but no play and maximum effect.

But the dolomite construction has no movement at all. When cornering and driving the angle of the lower arm compared to the stabi rod is constant different and that at both sides at the same time. A very stressed part and construction. All the different angles and movements are taken by that little bush. Up and down, left to right and front and rear in and out. At every wheel movement and most of the time on the otherside the oposite reaction movement. If that bush cannot flex because it's solid or even a slightly more solid than standard the stress area moves to the outershell and the little rod where they are welded together. In standard form they manage to snap and when hardening the bush they will in a short time. These are the only parts with a std suspension setup i go search in the shed and use the most worn ones. Those will last.

Jeroen

[misterp]

Meh...if the poly cost a few quid, then for the cost of the replacement poly ones (unless anyone can recommend somewhere that still produces the rubber type?) then even if they cost 5 quid a pop, then you can replace them a number of times before you get the cost of the Rimmer/Jigsaw/Superflex offerings.
Im also assuming by your comments that the ones Ive listed above come in a softer grade of poly?

Either way..Im waiting for delivery and will be trying with a $10 block of rubber, hole saw and we`ll see how it goes.

[Toledo Man]

Remember that not all polyurethane is created equal and there are varying grades. Jeroen has made a good point on the transferring of stresses to other parts of the ARB setup. It is for this reason that I would go for the Super Flex beucause it isn't much harder than rubber and the quality of the product is such that any transfer of stresses shouldn't be a problem under typical driving conditions (I could be wrong).

[xvivalve]

Meh...if the poly cost a few quid, then for the cost of the replacement poly ones (unless anyone can recommend somewhere that still produces the rubber type?) then even if they cost 5 quid a pop, then you can replace them a number of times before you get the cost of the Rimmer/Jigsaw/Superflex offerings.
Im also assuming by your comments that the ones Ive listed above come in a softer grade of poly?

Either way..Im waiting for delivery and will be trying with a $10 block of rubber, hole saw and we`ll see how it goes.

What Jeroen is trying o tell you here is if you use a harder compound bush, the bush won't necessarily fail but the bush housing itself will. Not something I'd like to happen when cornering hard.

[soe8m]

I would get the Super Flex ones without a moment's hesitation. The one from Jigsaw are made by Polybush.

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=25965

Before someone does buy.

Jeroen

[Toledo Man]

It would seem that the Polybush ones have failed like Jeroen said. Has anyone had any such problems with the Super Flex ones? I don't need to replace mine so I'll be leaving them well alone.

[soe8m]

During the suspension setup testing with the newly Dutch supercar i had interesting conversations with the party what was advising for it. That was a man who travelled around the world and did testing for major car manufactureres. He had some wise words. Imagen that you would replace all the bushes by uniball bearings of a suspension construction it should still be able to move up and down. He had seen enough that wouldn't.

The same as "our" front anti roll bar. I think std is best, no poly or superflex at all.

Jeroen

[misterp]

I think std is best, no poly or superflex at all.

Jeroen

Sounds like good advise, personally I prefer to stick to standard where possible unless Im planning on taking a car racing or at least push its limits.....but where can you still get standard rubber insert bushes for the Dolomites?
Anyone know of anywhere?

Cheers

Andrew

[misterp]

OK..as promised here is my attempt at making my own ARB bushes out of rubber.

In summary..success!! and for the $10 AUD (4 quid) I paid for the block of EPDM rubber, its an even better result.
Make up your own minds, but Im happy and I have plenty left to re-do again if the need arises.

So..this is what I started with..old and very past it rubber ARB bushes:



So, cleaned them out and started to make a suitable sized rubber bush.
I used a 32mm OD hole saw, so ~30mm ID with a 1/4" pilot hole to begin with. You want a bush around 25mm long to sit just inside the tapered ends of the bush tube.
The block of rubber I used is 100mm x 100mm x 50mm

So..drilling a pilot hole of 1/4" all the way through the block. This allows you to use the hole saw from both sides (the hole saw I had bottomed out around 25-30mm depth)



Then using the 32mm OD hole saw, cut the hole..slowly and use LOTS of silicon spray to keep it lubricated as the rubber starts to grip the holesaw, the deeper it goes.



Then..once you have your bush, drill a larger ~1/2" inner hole (any smaller and it becomes very difficult to push the bush home). The ends of the ARB are approx 13mm to they fit nice and snug into this newly drilled hole.



So, once you have your bush, again..jam it in the bush tube, and gradually prise the bush into the tube. I used a large-ish flat blade screwdriver and work your way round, bit by bit being careful not to damage the bush. Use plenty of silicone spray.



nearly there..



Finished product(s)



Nothing spectacular, and a lick of paint might have been nice, but 1.5hrs in the shed with a beer with the music on loud rather than watching some mundane reality home maker-over while cooking show is not bad in my opinion. As a bonus I didnt break anything either as is normally the way.

Hope it helps anyway.

Cheers

Andrew

[SprintnSideways]

I know this is an old thread - but Andrew- how have the 'new' rubber bushes performed so far?
I have the same problem here in Australia...nowhere to get the OEM bushes.
Pete

[misterp]

Hi Pete,

I havent really needed to check them until your thread!..so I suppose thats a good thing.

Looking thought, they look fine. When the suspension is on full droop they look squish enough but sitting flat they look like a normal bush which I think was some of the comments around poly bushes that might be too hard.

But...I think if I were to do it again, Id get some polyerethane and pour my own next time.
If you are in Perth, then Kirkside do pourable poly down to shore 40 which from what I can read about is better than rubber (apparently ~60 shore).

Cheers