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Re: Missing archive makes dating car impossible?
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 10:19 am
by Magenta Auto Sprint
going_downhill wrote: ↑Fri Feb 09, 2018 8:08 am
I guess it's as Carledo says. Find it's nearest siblings, I guess I could contact Gaydon about this and see where their Tw prefixs end and start. I doubt the DVLA will accept the findings even if I get ideal results. But it'll keep me busy and be the best course of action.
When I was looking to have an age related number plate for my 1942 Willys Jeep many years ago, the Willys production records stated
'chassis number 1501xx to 1502xx 2nd week of July 1942'. I sent this of DVLA and they accepted this, so I would assume that the nearest siblings route would work.
Re: Missing archive makes dating car impossible?
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 10:34 am
by Galileo
Sadly by the very late 70s/early 80s the gap between manufacture and sale for what by then would have been considered an old fashioned poorly made vehicle would be quite significant, with your average Dolomite sat in a car park (hopefully but not always a tarmac one, not uncommon to be parked in grassy fields) for quite awhile. You would more likely have been after a MK3 Ford Escort, Peugeot 305, Volvo 343...
Think I've gone OT.
Picture by Graham Richardson from
http://www.ourwarwickshire.org.uk/conte ... nley-1970s
Re: Missing archive makes dating car impossible?
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 2:08 pm
by RobSun
This may be of some help in dating yours. My 1300 is numbered 108699 so built after yours. The Heritage Certificate shows it was built on 14th May 1980 and sent to Hartwells of Oxford Ltd, outside the BL factory gates, on 20th May 1980. There it stayed until October 1982 when it was registered and collected by its retiring BL worker first owner, who then kept it until 2008 when he had to give up driving.
Re: Missing archive makes dating car impossible?
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 3:34 pm
by xvivalve
Carledo wrote: ↑Thu Feb 08, 2018 10:18 pm
I'd date 2062 to late August or early September of 79, but it's just an educated guess!
Steve
If it were late August '79 then it would have had the old style chassis number!
Re: Missing archive makes dating car impossible?
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 3:36 pm
by xvivalve
Galileo wrote: ↑Thu Feb 08, 2018 9:24 pm
Sorry Alun, would not have duplicated what you said, but started typing and then tried to find a source to back up what I remembered! The date digit thing (not 9th either) backs up that the Triumph VIN was not really a VIN in the world wide standard way that we take them as meaning today!
Found what I was looking for, not sure where I got this from though as a source, obviously not TDC forum:
First character
T= Triumph
Second character
F= Spitfire
P= TR7
Third character
A= EU
V= US
Z= California
L= Canadian
K= Australian
Fourth character
D= Convertible
E= Coupe
Fifth character
W= 1500cc
J= 2000cc
V= 3500cc
Sixth character
1= RHD
2= LHD
5= RHD, Overdrive
6= LHD, Overdrive
Seventh character
9= 1979
A= 1980
B= 1981
Eighth character
T= Canley
A= Solihull
Did Triumph use a completely different VIN style for the Dolomite than the Spitfire? I mean it sort of fits if you take the first numeric digit.
This does not align with the late Dolomite VIN codes
Re: Missing archive makes dating car impossible?
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 9:32 pm
by Carledo
xvivalve wrote: ↑Fri Feb 09, 2018 3:34 pm
Carledo wrote: ↑Thu Feb 08, 2018 10:18 pm
I'd date 2062 to late August or early September of 79, but it's just an educated guess!
Steve
If it were late August '79 then it would have had the old style chassis number!
Yeah, I missed that, for some reason I had it in my head that VINs started on 1st August, not 1st September, my bad! I'd still put 2062 in the first month of VINs though, seeing as it includes ALL Dolomites, not just Sprints like the VA numbers do.
Steve
I had a look at the VIN'd 1500HL Auto scrapper in my yard today, just out of curiosity. I never had the V5 and there is no heritage cert but it is registered on a W which began on 1st August 1980 and the VIN is TWFxx5AT 108622. So this one probably hung about up to a year between build and sale. Don't think it has been officially scrapped yet so it may be on the DVLA computer, must get the full reg off it and check. Just noticed the 1300 above is within 100 cars of this one with a build date in May'80.
Re: Missing archive makes dating car impossible?
Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 4:57 pm
by going_downhill
I've made the enquiry to the motor museum regarding looking up the earliest Triumph vin number that is numerically after that of my number. If I can then date this to Jan 8th or before i can submit to the DVLA with all body parts crossed in the hope they accept. If it fails, another year will have to pass before the cost savings begin
Re: Missing archive makes dating car impossible?
Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 1:41 pm
by going_downhill
So, as thought my car is a 1979 car. My vin ends "102062" which has definitely been misplaced so i cannot buy a heritage certificate. However, the Motor museum have confirmed that they do have records for an 1850HL dolomite "103026" which was built December 4th 1979. This vin is clearly MUCH later than my car so in reality is proof my car was built in 1979?
I wont be holding my breath but i guess this is as far as i can go with the research and evidence so I'll speak to the DVLA nearer the time and see what the score is. I guess i'd be happy to buy the heritage certificate for "103026" if they confirmed they would accept.. I will update in April 2020!
At least i know its a 79 car purely for my own personal knowledge!
Re: Missing archive makes dating car impossible?
Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2018 1:38 pm
by TrustNo1
Galileo wrote: ↑Thu Feb 08, 2018 9:24 pm
Sorry Alun, would not have duplicated what you said, but started typing and then tried to find a source to back up what I remembered! The date digit thing (not 9th either) backs up that the Triumph VIN was not really a VIN in the world wide standard way that we take them as meaning today!
Found what I was looking for, not sure where I got this from though as a source, obviously not TDC forum:
First character
T= Triumph
Second character
F= Spitfire
P= TR7
Third character
A= EU
V= US
Z= California
L= Canadian
K= Australian
Fourth character
D= Convertible
E= Coupe
Fifth character
W= 1500cc
J= 2000cc
V= 3500cc
Sixth character
1= RHD
2= LHD
5= RHD, Overdrive
6= LHD, Overdrive
Seventh character
9= 1979
A= 1980
B= 1981
Eighth character
T= Canley
A= Solihull
Did Triumph use a completely different VIN style for the Dolomite than the Spitfire? I mean it sort of fits if you take the first numeric digit.
Just to add to this for reference.....
2nd Character... W = dolomite
3rd................ F = UK
4th................ L = Saloon.
6th................ 3 = RHD Auto. 4= LHD Auto.
My May 1981 registered 1500HL also as A (106732) for 1980 but I've never got around to getting an Heritage Cert.
Re: Missing archive makes dating car impossible?
Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2018 7:59 pm
by Graham04
Just to add to this for reference.....
2nd Character... W = dolomite
3rd................ F = UK
4th................ L = Saloon.
6th................ 3 = RHD Auto. 4= LHD Auto.
My 1500HL Auto follows and confirms the above example TWFLW3AT107859 registered 14/7/1980. At least it didn't sit in a field for months.