5-speed sprint?

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White Flame

Re: ^

#16 Post by White Flame »

X-pat wrote:
Al Williams wrote:
Judging from the picture of your car and the front spoiler I think we have exchanged emails in the past.

I think you may have bought something of eBay from me, can't be sure for certain though! :lol:


Hi Al, Yes, and you very kindly sent me some excellent polishing cloth as an extra - brought the bumpers up a treat! :D
Glad to have helped!

Good luck with the conversion :D
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xvivalve
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#17 Post by xvivalve »

It does fit...I just can't tell you how.

I need to take some photo's of the car to send to Steve; I'll get what I can of the 'box arrangement for you. Time remains against me at the moment; I still have 3 wheels on my trailer for want of getting the hub to a machine shop...
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X-pat
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#18 Post by X-pat »

xvivalve wrote:It does fit...I just can't tell you how.

I need to take some photo's of the car to send to Steve; I'll get what I can of the 'box arrangement for you. Time remains against me at the moment; I still have 3 wheels on my trailer for want of getting the hub to a machine shop...

Thanks Alun, photos would probably be a big help. I sent a PM to Steve Martin, as you suggested, but no reply so far. I'm in no rush - waiting for a new rad for my Esprit (courtesy of the DPO who didn't take any care of it, but graciously overfilled the cooling system prior to me picking it up, leading me to blow a hole in it when driving home), and also fighting with my wife's Dodge (well named). :cry:
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#19 Post by X-pat »

So, after a few weeks pondering the wisdom of this, I'm getting back to it. I haven't been slacking - honest! :D After fixing up the Dodgy for sale, shoehorning an oversized radiator into the Lotus and doing a full service (plus extras :P ) on my daily transport, I've finally got some time. Previously, I left SUS with the engine and box inserted (partially - engine mounts located and attached, but box not going in any further). I also managed to talk to Steve Martin on the phone, who was very helpful. Two things he said were very useful. First, part of the bellhousing needs to be removed. Second, the standard LT77 slave cylinder is unusable as there is no room with the Dolly steering rack being where it is. This is just as well, as the slave cylinder section of the bellhousing seems to be what needs to be removed (pics to follow, hopefully - see below). As far as the clutch goes, the bellhousing needs to be drilled/reamed to take the Sprint/TR6 type clutch cross-shaft, the technique being to line up the LT77 unit with the Sprint unit, measure, and drill!! From looking at it today, there doesn't seem to be any need to remove the rear crossmember from the subframe as there seems to be plenty of space (other than where the slave cylinder fits on the RHS), which makes me breathe a little easier. :jump4joy:

If someone can tell me how to upload graphics files, I'll post some pics of the problem area. I just can't figure it out just now. :sozzled:
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#20 Post by X-pat »

OK, I think I figured it out. Amazing what a good night's sleep does....:D

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Jon Tilson
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Err...

#21 Post by Jon Tilson »

What about the fact that the Sprint has an ally gearbox spacer ring and the TR7 engine doesn't.

I will have this problem myself as I intend to fit a TR7 5 speed setup in a dolly shell. I was going to remove the bit of bell hosuing and use a clutch cable but the idea of using the Sprint/stag cross shaft is an interesting one.

Not sure how the slave mounting bracket would bolt to the LT77 box though as it has no top cover as such.

Jonners
Note from Admin: sadly Jon passed away in February 2018 but his humour and wealth of knowledge will be fondly remembered by all. RIP Jonners.
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#22 Post by X-pat »

The TR7 Sprint set up doesn't use a spacer - the 16v engine just bolts straight onto the 5-speed gearbox. As far as I can see, the spacer fitted to the Dolomite allows the starter motor to be fitted at the left side of the engine (thus avoiding a clash with the oil pump), whereas using the gearbox without spacer (as in TR6) has the starter on the right side. Consequently, the input shaft on the Dolomite is, I believe, longer than the TR6 item to accommodate the length of the spacer. As you'll see from the pics, I already have the engine and gearbox mated together, only the slave cylinder housing is preventing final alignment and connection to the propshaft.

From my conversation with Steve Martin, he suggested fabricating a bracket to hold the slave cylinder and welding it (or otherwise attaching it) to the gearbox. Sounds reasonable to me, and seemed to work for him in the quicksprint.

I'm going to try to move ahead with this, now that I can see where the problems seem to be. Once I can locate a good machine shop to drill the bellhousing, I should be able to make progress. I'll post pics as I go along, hopefully they will be useful. :D Fortunately (as part of my "plan B") I now have a TR6 gearbox to hand, so making the measurements for the cross-shaft and translating these onto the TR7 unit should be straightforward............is anything ever??? :lol:

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5-speed sprint - Update

#23 Post by X-pat »

Finally - the engine and gearbox are back in and connected up to the propshaft. Oil added today to both. Minor leak from bypass tube once I added the coolant, similar problem from flexi-hose connection to slave cylinder, couldn't seem to get it tight enough, so no clutch yet :roll: ....but it's been much worse!

First time, I had to take the engine/box back out for the clearance reasons shown in previous posts. It took a while to get the bellhousing modified. Took 2 months to find a machine shop that would drill the holes for the cross-shaft - then they said it would cost me $500!! So, I decided to do it myself. (I'll post the pics and measurements at a later stage once I get them in order.) Also had to cut off the slave cylinder housing and weld a plate over to close the gap. I also welded the slave cylinder bracket onto the side of the gearbox.
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Reassembled engine, gearbox, exhaust (to check for clearance of the cross-shaft and slave cylinder),
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removed the exhaust again and put the unit back in the car. Wired up to new low torque starter, turned key..........click! Starter was engaging but the flywheel wasn't going anywhere. :evil: Nothing for it but to remove everything again and figure out what the problem was. Very discouraging - but at least I was getting my money's worth out of the crane. :D

Found that I couldn't rotate the crankshaft - to cut a long story short, I found that the flywheel was binding on the bolts that hold the backplate onto the back of the block. :oops: I tried grinding these down, but still short of clearance, so I ended up getting countersunk hex drive bolts and countersinking these in the backplate. This solved the problem - but I assembled and tested everything out of the car this time to make sure. :D
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Back in again, exhaust reconnected, all new hoses, new rad, moved the electric pump from boot to engine bay, points set, static timing done. Even figured how to put on the linkage for the Dellortos. Engine is turning on starter, but I'm not getting any pressure reading on the oil pressure guage. Maybe a connection got pulled when I was removing engine/box or transmission tunnel, will investigate in due course. There was a leak from the spin-on oil filter housing, so I just switched back to the standard one for now, until I get everything sorted.

Immediate goals - fix the leaks, bleed the clutch, sort out the oil pressure guage, then set up the carbs (a new experience for me after only doing SUs before). At least I'm not bored..... :lol:
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Re: 5-speed sprint?

#24 Post by Jon Tilson »

Shame you didnt see the threads on TR7 to 1850 conversions where we discussed that the TR7 end plate
is counter sunk and uses countersunk cross head bolts to attach it to the engine...
so you have to use the 1850 end plate and flywheel or cut off the slave cylinder bit on the TR7 one if you want to keep
the TR7 flywheel...

There was a guy on ebya who sold one with a conversion using a clutch cable...neevr did get the pics of how that was done.

Looks like a very professional job though....good work.

Jonners
Note from Admin: sadly Jon passed away in February 2018 but his humour and wealth of knowledge will be fondly remembered by all. RIP Jonners.
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Re: 5-speed sprint?

#25 Post by X-pat »

Jon Tilson wrote:Shame you didnt see the threads on TR7 to 1850 conversions where we discussed that the TR7 end plate
is counter sunk and uses countersunk cross head bolts to attach it to the engine...
so you have to use the 1850 end plate and flywheel or cut off the slave cylinder bit on the TR7 one if you want to keep
the TR7 flywheel...

Yes, I saw this after the fact. :cry:

What I couldn't figure is why the late Sprint flywheel and TR7 share the same part number, yet I had to do this modification. Also, initially I used a TR7 end plate - which wasn't countersunk either!!! :o
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Re: 5-speed sprint?

#26 Post by X-pat »

At last - progress. The clutch works (see "clutch slave" thread). I ended up using the TR7 slave cylinder, although I will probably swap back when I can get the correct hydraulic fitting for the SS clutch hose.

My replacement Facet fuel pump arrived today, bargain at $60 from E-bay (new). Now I can throw away the old one that left me stranded at many, many interesting locations throughout Britain (until I figured it was the fuel pump that was the problem and not the carbs or Piranha ignition :roll: ). Now I'm getting petrol up to the carbs - and had the engine running briefly :jump4joy: but shut it down quickly as no coolant in the system yet. Still have a leak from the connecting tube where it goes into the manifold. Doesn't seem to be much of a seat for the o-ring to rest on in the new manifold compared to the original. I will take it off again tomorrow and see if I can get it sealed any better, at least long enough to let me get it filled with coolant without getting my feet wet.

Good oil pressure, 60psi cold, but a minor leak from the blanking plate on the side of the block. Will try to rectify that also.
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Re: 5-speed sprint?

#27 Post by X-pat »

Manifold off again today, repositioned the connecting pipe and o-rings, refitted. While it was off, I resealed the fuel pump blanking plate. Started to fill the cooling system - still had a leak from the connecting pipe. Filled up as much as I could, started and ran the engine and bled the system. Fingers crossed, eventually the leak seemed to stop, also the weeping from the water pump slot.

Without any balancing or mixture adjustment, the engine is idling around 650rpm, and very smooth. Can't go any further with it just now - temp sender seems to be knackered and I don't want to risk overheating. I had bought a new one from Rimmers, but it was much longer than the one I had and was fouling on the thermostat. Anyone else had this problem? Usually the parts I get from them are correct. Not sure if it's a different part for the sidedraft manifold.
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newguy

Re: 5-speed sprint?

#28 Post by newguy »

X-pat wrote:
Good oil pressure, 60psi cold, but a minor leak from the blanking plate on the side of the block. Will try to rectify that also.
Is this the plate that the engine hooks on on the firewall side of the head?
I think thats where i am leaking also etc.
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Re: 5-speed sprint?

#29 Post by X-pat »

newguy wrote: Is this the plate that the engine hooks on on the firewall side of the head?
I think thats where i am leaking also etc.

No - it's where the fuel pump should be. I have an electric pump, so the gap is blanked off with a small plate. But I've had leaks from the area I think you are describing, although I think it was mostly from the D-rubber at the back of the cam cover.
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newguy

Re: 5-speed sprint?

#30 Post by newguy »

ahhhh ok doki
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