Some myth-busting questions for the Aussies.

[Sundowner]

Each month my (generic) car club asks a member to give a talk about their car.
Next month, July, its my turn and since I've already spoken about my T and Zephyr, I guess its the Sprint's turn too.
However, I need to ask a few questions and I feel that some of the Aussies already educated in the Dolomite university, would be best placed to answer.
Being unable to find any real documentation to answer these questions, I figured I ask them here.
I'm told that Leyland Australia imported just 620 Sprints, all Mimosa Yellow and less than 100 are left (known about) Is this correct?
I'm also told that just a handful of them came into the country privately, mainly through Ron Hodgson (dealer), and that two of them were Broadspeed Sprints that he raced here. Is that correct?
Another question I'd like to have clarified is that John Laws' wife had a privately imported white Sprint.
I'd greatly appreciate any additional info on these points and also welcome any extra Sprint information prior to my talk next month.
In other words, I need all the help I can get.
Thanks in advance,
Cheers,
Rob.

[baz]

Hi,
Those Sprint figures "seem' about right as far as i know. Yes they were all mimosa(or as some call it 'baby poo' colour!).
I do know only 49 has LSD's.
Check out Sprintparts - http://www.sprintparts.triumphowners.com/sprints.cgi
Bit of info on there. As for John laws wife , I had heard the rumour but ????
Sorry not much help???

[straylight]

I have around 85 sprints in my database Rob, so 100+ might be close to the actual number left. They keep popping up on ebay and carsales

restored cars 2009 had a good article, I'll precis that as best I can:

620 sprints, estimated 25% survival
1500-2000 dolomites
they were only imported for 18 months (1975 until mid 1976 ?), as ADR27A pollution standards for cars 6/1976 onwards couldn't be met.

Oz price in 1975 $7700 (compare to a p76 at $4500 !) and UK price at the time was 2438 quid ($4876), so a hefty import cost. v8 kingswoods were selling at $4100.

Mimosa for sprints and dolomites were allowed any colour except mimosa !

(written by a Robert Brady)

on the racing side Phil and Mark Lamour will be wiser, but the youtube footgae of Jack Brabham being rear ended by a sprint on the Bathurst grid always gets a chuckle.

stu

[Sundowner]

Stu & Baz,
Thank You Gents, thats just the sort of stuff I was after.
Much appreciated,
Cheers,
Rob

[DoloWIGHTY]

Why just Sprints?

Surely if you are doing the letter T you could ask more general questions on Triumphs? Or maybe if you feel that is just too general for a Sprint owner ask questions on Dolomites and the other small Triumph saloons?

[Sundowner]

Alan,
Its about SPRINT's.....because my car is a SPRINT
The "T" in my initial post indicates a Ford model T and I have already delivered a talk on it.
My Mk1 Zephyr also has been the subject of a talk and that leaves just my Dolomite SPRINT.
There are only 2 Dolomites in my club and both of them are SPRINT's.
Cheers,
Rob.

[DoloWIGHTY]

Okay, fair enough Rob. I didn't read your post properly. Sorry.

[SPRINTPARTS]

Each month my (generic) car club asks a member to give a talk about their car.
Next month, July, its my turn and since I've already spoken about my T and Zephyr, I guess its the Sprint's turn too.
However, I need to ask a few questions and I feel that some of the Aussies already educated in the Dolomite university, would be best placed to answer.
Being unable to find any real documentation to answer these questions, I figured I ask them here.
I'm told that Leyland Australia imported just 620 Sprints, all Mimosa Yellow and less than 100 are left (known about) Is this correct?
I'm also told that just a handful of them came into the country privately, mainly through Ron Hodgson (dealer), and that two of them were Broadspeed Sprints that he raced here. Is that correct?
Another question I'd like to have clarified is that John Laws' wife had a privately imported white Sprint.
I'd greatly appreciate any additional info on these points and also welcome any extra Sprint information prior to my talk next month.
In other words, I need all the help I can get.
Thanks in advance,
Cheers,
Rob.

Hi Rob- all of the road cars (620) were imported by Leyland Australia. Ron Hodgson imported two EX-BTTC Broadspeed cars, of which I own one. There were three additional race cars built by the Hodgson team using the two Broadspeed cars as masters. I have no idea about John Laws' wifes car. I am not aware of any privately imported Sprints for road use- the import regulations for private imports in parallel with cars imported by the local distributor is very strict. It may be the Laws car was repainted locally. I know that the Hodgson Team chief engineer (Ron Missen) had a white Sprint road car, complete with Broadspeed badges, but I think it was locally cloned. As Baz suggested look at our website for additional information.
Regards
Philip

[straylight]

Batemans Bay Rob ? Or Ulladulla ? The south coast of NSW is beautiful. Car looks great.

Now I feel bad DoloWhighty, I culled all of the dolomite info from that article I should add that while the kiwis had a love affair with triumphs and imported/assembled all manner of toledos and dolomites, we only got given the 1850 and sprint out of the range. There was a Toledo mentioned in the article that was a private import that did urban transport duty in Sydney.

stu

edit: just noticed the number plate. Is that a special historic reg plate from NSW Rob ? What's the deal over there with historic reg ?

[Sundowner]

Thanks Phillip,
That's excellent info for my talk. Excellent.

Stu,
That's the Moruya river in the background. About 25kms south of Batemans Bay and yes.....I live in paradise.
You're right, that is a NSW Historic Vehicle plate. The deal is you must be a member of a state recognised vintage vehicle club. The vehicle needs to be over 30 years of age. You need to keep a log book of all trips and apart from only being able to travel to club sanctioned events or accepting invitations to other clubs events, you can only drive it on test runs, to be serviced, or for repairs. A club nominated and suitably qualified inspector needs to check it over annually. It might sound restrictive, but for just $53 (approx) per year, I think its brilliant. I have 3 vehicles on the scheme and as a result I get cheap vintage vehicle insurance too.
I don't think its much different to the SA scheme is it?

Once again, thanks for the info gentlemen....its just what I needed.

Cheers,
Rob

[Toledo Man]

Here's another Pommie wading in...

What about the car in general? I'm thinking of things such as the people who developed the car and the engine (Giovanni Michelotti, Harry Webster, Spen King and the often-forgotten Lew Daltrey) and how can we forget the FWD cars and the Toledo that preceeded the 1850 and the Sprint. The FWD cars in turn came about by the decision to replace the Herald shortly after it was introduced (things turned out differently as it happened). After all, the original Dolomite 1850 was just a 1500fwd body with Toledo running gear mated to the slant-4 engine. Most of my knowledge came from the AROnline website and Rimmer's "Dolomite & Sprint" catalogue. There's a page on Rimmer's website HERE which gives the story of how the car was developed. I don't know the extent of your own knowledge so I apologize if you know all this.

I hope this is of any help to you.

[Sundowner]

Here's another Pommie wading in...
I don't know the extent of your own knowledge so I apologize if you know all this.
I hope this is of any help to you.

It sure is of help, thank you. And I don't know all of it.
My problem is mainly with the Australian side of things because there were so few Dolomites here, there is no documentation just waiting for the man in the street to pick up and read.
However, things in Britain were (comparatively) comprehensively documented. There are books written about the design, bloodline and manufacture of Dolomites and their cousins. Not so, here.
Thanks again Toledo Man,
Rob.
PS; I'm married to an Australian-ised English born girl.

[SPRINTPARTS]

Some more info in addition to what the Philip has written.

As stated all Leyland Australia imports were Mimosa. There has been a handful of private imports as well. I was once told of a Honeysuckle automatic Sprint that was an ex British Consulate car, don't know if it still exists. Any Australian delivered Sprint that is not Mimosa is either a repaint (a few) or a rebody using 1850 shell (a lot). Apart from the 40+ LSD cars the only other option that was offered was a locally fitted (Dealer) Air Conditioning. I have one of these cars and have only ever know of 2 others, which I know at least one does not exist any more.

For a car that was only offered for new sale for just over 12 months (May 1975 to June 1976) they have survived reasonably well. From memory there was 7 Sprints used in the ATCC (or Bathurst) over the years. At least 5 of those still survive, 2 of which are ex Broadspeed built cars used in the BTCC. One of those cars is one used by Andy Rouse to twin the 1975 Championship the Silver/green car.

Would suggest that the 3 Dolomite race cars that Philip and myself own have possibly done more racing than any other Sprints any where in the world. I don't know the number of races for Philips car, but it basically raced continually from 1975 to 2010. My own ex ATCC car (Ron Hodgson built car) has done around 95 race meeting and the my ex Series Production car now improved Production is around 100. So between the 3 cars I would guess that we have around 300 race meeting with them.

Mark

[Jon Tilson]

Toledo man was a tad simplistic in his few lines.

While the dolomite did use the 1500fwd bodyshell, there is very little in common with the Toledo running gear wise.

The axle has different brakes and a bespoke ratio, the gearbox comes from the Vitesse and the engine is Triumphs first aplication of their own engine used first in the SAAB 99,
developed to have a lot in common with the Stag. Had the Rover-Triumph merger with BMC not been forced on them I suspect we would have seen some more developments on the
ohc family and the ohv stuff would have been dropped a lot earlier. In fact its the Rover engineer, Spen King who was responsbible for the angled studs and Michelloti's ill health and eventual death
lead to the Harris Man regime, producer of the ugly TR7 as if the Allegro wasnt crap enough to have sacked him....while Bayche from Rover had his hands full with the SD1.

It could all have been so different when you think what a fantastic range of cars Triumph had in 72.....

Spen rightly gets a lot of accolades for his Rover work, but he was liitle use to Triumph IMO...

Funny that when that Canadian guy with the beard who later turned BL into Rover group said there was room in the market for another BMW, he didnt seem to realise that in 72
it was more like BMW was another Triumph, only not so good.

You couldn't have made that degree of incompetetnce up...

Jonners

[straylight]

thread necromancy sorry, but rereading this after tracking down a brilliant article on the Shannon's website (car insurer) here:

https://www.shannons.com.au/club/news/r ... er-madeit/

you can read it in full by creating an account (free) and I'm reluctant to quote the whole thing. It gives a really good insight into the attempt to race the sprint in Oz. It confirms the reason why sprints importation into Oz ceased in 1976 due to ADR regulations to do with pollution.

The other thing that reading old threads brought up, was enjoying Jonners insight into the running of leyland in the 70s.