Wiring LED indicators - baffled

[alolympic]

I should know better than try and do something that involves wiring....
Anyway.
I want to remove the front indicator units. Short story is, I think they are ugly and blot the great design of the front of the car. I will fill the holes and re paint the valance., as if they were never there. The car will look less fussy at the front. Yes, I know, time wasting really, but I am always tinkering.....
I have been using the outer headlight marker light as sidelights for years now, so the original sidelight unit isn't needed for that. I have now fitted new LED's in the bowl, works great.

Now, I want to use LED's to replace the indicators. I am actually going to use a small round Amber LED not much bigger than the head of a bumper bolt. Drill the hole in the vertical face of the bumper and fit, for a discreet solution.

Tonight I tried to wire the LED before drilling, just to make sure that everything will work. It doesn't.....

I have looked on the wiki page for indicators and none of the images are loading, so am looking for some guidance on the wiring.

The LED's have 2 wires, Earth and live.
The original sidelight/indicator unit has 3 wires; earth, one for the sidelight and one for the indicator.

Any advice on what to wire to what.
I tried by cutting and sealing the original sidelight wire, as it no longer needed. Then linking the 2 wires on the new LED with the original loom.
The indicator dash light comes on but doesn't flash. And the LED now does not light up.
Help......is it my wiring or the low current draw of the LED?

[Galileo]

You'll need to change your flasher unit that's for sure, it relies on 2 x 21w to heat and cool a bimetallic strip that causes the contacts to make and break, so with just a low wattage LED connected there will be not enough current to heat the strip up. Fit an electronic flasher unit instead, first hit for £3.80 delivered but you might want to shop around:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Electronic-Flas ... B00EQ1U6ZI

[Jon Tilson]

What he said....

Also remember the code....red wire for side light and green (maybe plus trace) for the indicator light, black for earth.

Jonners

[Pippin]

I am actually going to use a small round Amber LED not much bigger than the head of a bumper bolt. Drill the hole in the vertical face of the bumper and fit, for a discreet solution.

Sorry to be a spoilsport, but I suspect that front indicators are required to be of a certain minimum size. Just pointing this out so that you can consider it before doing anything irreversible.

[Galileo]

I am actually going to use a small round Amber LED not much bigger than the head of a bumper bolt. Drill the hole in the vertical face of the bumper and fit, for a discreet solution.

Sorry to be a spoilsport, but I suspect that front indicators are required to be of a certain minimum size. Just pointing this out so that you can consider it before doing anything irreversible.

Plenty of things required according to C&U regs, but nothing oddly on the size, just the brightness levels, and the lawmakers favourite cop out clause of 'reasonable' when it comes to brightness!

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1989 ... ule/7/made

6. Size of illuminated area:

No requirement

7. Colour–

Amber

8. Wattage–

(a) Any front or rear indicator which emits a flashing light and does not bear an approval mark: 15 to 36 watts
(b) Any other indicator: No requirement

9. Intensity–

(a) An indicator bearing an approval mark: No requirement
(b) An indicator not bearing an approval mark: Such that the light is plainly visible from a reasonable distance

Edit: Just occurred to me about the wattage point, surely that means all LED indicators fail to meet the law?!

[AlanH]

I want to remove the front indicator units.

That would make room for fog lights.

[alolympic]

What he said....

Also remember the code....red wire for side light and green (maybe plus trace) for the indicator light, black for earth.

Jonners

Thanks guys, appreciate the help.
Will order some electronic flashers tonight.
In terms of the actual wiring...because I am rubbish at electrics (and mechanicals, but let's leave it there)....
Do I connect the black wire on the led to the black wire on the original loom, or do they both just need to be connected to an earth point?
Cheers

[alolympic]

I want to remove the front indicator units.

That would make room for fog lights.

But that would be function above form?! You obviously don't know how superficial I am

[Galileo]

What he said....

Also remember the code....red wire for side light and green (maybe plus trace) for the indicator light, black for earth.

Jonners

Thanks guys, appreciate the help.
Will order some electronic flashers tonight.
In terms of the actual wiring...because I am rubbish at electrics (and mechanicals, but let's leave it there)....
Do I connect the black wire on the led to the black wire on the original loom, or do they both just need to be connected to an earth point?
Cheers

Assuming that the colour scheme on the LED is battery negative for black, then yes, it would connect to the black earth feed wire (battery negative), and your remaining LED live wire on the green wire (battery positive via flasher relay). The now redundant red side light feed can be taped off, or for a safer longer lasting result use some heat shrink.

The only reason that you're seeing nothing happening with your LED is mostly just the lack of current, try turning on the hazard lights, might flash but at the wrong speed.

[cliftyhanger]

Watch out for colours with imported lighting. Some stuff I did a while ago had white black and green (these were dipped and main type lights) The earth was the white........

You can check which is which by connecting the bare wire ends direct to the battery.

[tony g]

Just a word of warning here. If you end up with 4 led flasher bulbs and you have a single dash flasher indicator youll encounter what I did. Have a read of this
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=29108&hilit=led+indicators+tony

Tony

[Jon Tilson]

In the case of dolomite/toledo from light units the unit only requires a seperate earth wire at all becuase the unit
is effectivley insulated from the car body by the rubber casing old older versions or the gasket on newer ones.

The earth wire just goes to a bullet connect that fits into a crimped on loop on the back of the unit. This of course degrades
over time leading to dim and slow flashing bulbs etc...

The black wire from the unit goes back into the loom and thence to an earth point on the car body. I've added an earth point for my
cars on the nearside wing which is also used by my horns and electric fan. Older cars have bullets in tube joiners which are
pathetic tbh and the newer cars have a slightly better three pin plug effort that meets up in the middle of the lower front valance
which isn't the best of places for resisting damp and corrosion of pins etc...and is another favourite place for side light units
to loose connections.

Jonners

[alolympic]

Thanks guys, I will report back, with the result and some photos if it works.

In the case of dolomite/toledo from light units the unit only requires a seperate earth wire at all becuase the unit
is effectivley insulated from the car body by the rubber casing old older versions or the gasket on newer ones.

The earth wire just goes to a bullet connect that fits into a crimped on loop on the back of the unit. This of course degrades
over time leading to dim and slow flashing bulbs etc...

The black wire from the unit goes back into the loom and thence to an earth point on the car body. I've added an earth point for my
cars on the nearside wing which is also used by my horns and electric fan. Older cars have bullets in tube joiners which are
pathetic tbh and the newer cars have a slightly better three pin plug effort that meets up in the middle of the lower front valance
which isn't the best of places for resisting damp and corrosion of pins etc...and is another favourite place for side light units
to loose connections.
Jonners

Cheers Jonners, really helpful.
I hadn't considered that my slow and dim front indicators would likely be improved by making the earth good again, makes sense. Not the only thing slow and dim it seems

[alolympic]

Just fitted the 2 new electronic flasher units.
Wired to earth. Wired 1 new LED indicator to test.
Now I have no indicators and no light on dash.
So, I have rear LED indicators, which were working before this. 1 LED front indicator and 1 original indicator.
What could I be doing wrong?

[Jon Tilson]

Ok be systematic.

Put it all back as it was with bulbs at the front, old flasher units rear led bulbs etc - get it working.
Then change one thing at a time...indicator flasher unit first probably. The new flasher units SHOULD be load independent.
Then try the hazard flasher, which often suffers from a dirty switch contact as its hopefully seldom used.
Just pull it in and out a few times...

A duff feed from the hazard switch can take out the lot.

You have to do this sort of thing from a known working starting position and then change 1 thing at a time and confirm it works
as expected.

Jonners