a couple of questions about brakes!

[Carledo]

You don't have any problem with the flexi fouling the top b/j/ wishbone under load on lock?

Steve

[tony g]

No its all good there so far. Ive checked for rub marks and there are none. Road car mind so not leaning like you might lol. When I did a test with the coil over adjusters wound upwards the pipe was clear in more than I would consider normal compression. I think as Ive used the braided hose with a 90 deg fitting I can aim it where its best maybe. A screw in like the oem Ford may need a bit more routing maybe.

Tony

[Pippin]

I'm sure there is a reason for not doing it that way Tony, blessed if I know what it is though! Steve

There surely is a reason, although I can't think what it is either, otherwise, why do car manufacturers almost always mount them on the rear?

[tony g]

I'm sure there is a reason for not doing it that way Tony, blessed if I know what it is though! Steve

There surely is a reason, although I can't think what it is either, otherwise, why do car manufacturers almost always mount them on the rear?

Thats nonsense im afraid. The ford calipers im using ARE fitted to the front on the Ford

Tony

[trackerjack]

When I first made up the conversion on my Sprint I had the calipers set as Triumph did (3 o clock) but they fouled the wishbones and never tried them in the front position.

If it works its fine and I think most cars fit calipers to the front these days and probably because the swept area is more open to the front hence more clearance.

[sprint95m]

To the front or to the back, this discussion has come up before.

For the front brakes,
Back wheel drive cars.....calipers to the back. (There are a few exceptions,e.g. mark 2 Cortina GT and E, the very first BMW 3 series)
Front wheel drive...........calipers to the front.


The previous discussion failed to give a definite explanation as to why this is so.
I think it is to do with the best location for unsprung weight, but that very theoretical stuff is way beyond me I'm afraid.




Ian.

[tony g]

My choice was purely to run the brake pipe neater

Tony

[Carledo]

I was going to say that the flexi pipe position, which is counter intuitively forward of the axle line, despite the steel feed pipe emerging through the flitch aft of the axle is a relic of the drum braked Toledo, where the hose feeds directly into the forward wheel cylinder. This because I was thinking of the Toledo as the first "proper" Dolomite as it predates even the disc equipped 1500 FWD as well as the Dolomite 1850 itself.
Then I remembered that the 1300 FWD has discs too and certainly predates the Toledo. At this point I have to admit to loss of memory and ignorance. Loss of memory cos my mum owned a 1300TC FWD and ignorance cos I really don't know! So my (long winded) question is, which side of the axle line is the caliper on a 1300FWD? The theory expressed by Ian (which with a couple of exceptions, I also subscribe to) that FWD cars normally have their calipers forward of the axle line would also explain why the pipe layout is as it is and Triumph just added a bit on, rather than change the design for later models.
Which brings me to a further logical experiment on my Sprint, ie to fabricate a new hose mounting bracket for the flexi to be mounted immediately below the steel pipe exit hole in the flitch and aft of the axle line so that a single flexi can thence feed directly into the floating caliper used by the TJ kit. Comments? Suggestions?

Steve

[tony g]

This what I would have done if I was welding the car anyway, but as its original body hasnt been welded yet I didnt want to spoil the inner wing

Tony


Which brings me to a further logical experiment on my Sprint, ie to fabricate a new hose mounting bracket for the flexi to be mounted immediately below the steel pipe exit hole in the flitch and aft of the axle line so that a single flexi can thence feed directly into the floating caliper used by the TJ kit. Comments? Suggestions?

Steve[/quote]

[Carledo]

This what I would have done if I was welding the car anyway, but as its original body hasnt been welded yet I didnt want to spoil the inner wing

Tony


Which brings me to a further logical experiment on my Sprint, ie to fabricate a new hose mounting bracket for the flexi to be mounted immediately below the steel pipe exit hole in the flitch and aft of the axle line so that a single flexi can thence feed directly into the floating caliper used by the TJ kit. Comments? Suggestions?

Steve

[/quote]

I don't have that worry, since my car is about as unoriginal as it's possible to be and still justify wearing the badges!
My potential problem (which will, I think, only be solved by experiment) is where the amount of flexi needed for full lock and full drop will go under compression and on the other lock. Careful attention to routing and angles will be required, I fancy!

Steve

[xvivalve]

Think about the dynamics of braking.

A front wheel drive car can be retarded at any point on the disc without much ill effect as it is the driven wheel being slowed; it doesn't matter therefore how light the back end gets. If it is rear wheel drive however, the brake needs to drag on the disc else the effect would be similar to relying only on the front brake of a bike...or sticking a broom stick through the spokes at high speed!

It would be novel to be able to do stoppies in a car, but you'd need strong arms to keep the wheels pointing forwards! At very best, the rear end would become extremely 'light'.

[xvivalve]

I've been arguing with myself about this, but conclude I am right; it is all about the fulcrum point and where load is applied relative to it.

Think of a rwd car like a wheel barrow; if you had a braked wheel barrow, having the caliper forward of the point of rotation would cause the barrow to tip when the brakes are applied, having the caliper behind the wheel won't. With a barrow, the bloke pushing is the driven wheels, and it would be most inconvenient to have the barrow wanting to tip upon braking.

The only counter to this would be if the barrow was fully laden, the load would resist the turning effect of the brake, so it would only be 'safe' to have the caliper forward of the rotation if the car was exceptionally heavy...and didn't go very fast!

[soe8m]

Purely practical. Most rwd cars have the trackrods at the front and fwd cars at the rear. You want as less heat in the near of balljoints so triumph did a good job on the dolomite.

Some competition car's and f1 have the calipers at the bottom for lower centre of gravity. When a wheel is braked the parts attached, a car or wheel barrow want to turn around it. Having drum brakes on your wheelbarrow will have the same effect.

Jeroen

[xvivalve]

Having drum brakes on your wheelbarrow will have the same effect.

Jeroen

Lever, fulcrum and load; the point at which the load is applied will make a huge difference, particularly so if it moves from one side of the fulcrum to the other despite the actual distance being small.

(but yes, I take your point that the parts attached will want to rotate around the wheel in all cases)

[tony g]

But the rack is at the rear and so is the caliper on a Dolomite... Did they do a different version?

Purely practical. Most rwd cars have the trackrods at the front and fwd cars at the rear. You want as less heat in the near of balljoints so triumph did a good job on the dolomite.

Some competition car's and f1 have the calipers at the bottom for lower centre of gravity. When a wheel is braked the parts attached, a car or wheel barrow want to turn around it. Having drum brakes on your wheelbarrow will have the same effect.

Jeroen