Should I fit a servo?

[cliftyhanger]

My toledo hasn't had a servo since I had it. But I am finding the braking a tad worrying thesedays, the spit has excellent brakes, and all my other cars have servo's (even our proper mini)
I am thinking a servo would be a sensible first step as the car is not going on track, besides if I need bigger brakes, a servo would be wise anyway.

Or should I just cobble together some better brakes?
(I did try an MGF disc,240mm, on Saturday, only to find the tolly/dolly front hub would need machining to fit, but it is still a possibility! Then just some modern calipers and make a bracket to connect calipers to upright. Easy!)

[soe8m]

A big mistake is thinking a servo does make a car brake better. It does not, only making you push the pedal with less force.

Jeroen

[sprint95m]

I would fit the bigger brakes first.





Ian.

[cliftyhanger]

A big mistake is thinking a servo does make a car brake better. It does not, only making you push the pedal with less force.

Jeroen

Exactly, I understand that. The brakes are OK, just need a big old prod to get them to work, which is the worrying bit.

Maybe you are correct, maybe time to get some discs and calipers sorted....and as I can use bigger wheels I could happily use bigger discs than 240mm. We shall see what turns up!

[Carledo]

Is the car an original drum model? And does it still have drums fitted? As a rough guide, all Toledos got discs during 73 (so J, K, or L reg cars were drum braked from new) AFAIK, when the change to discs occurred, the servo went on with them. I've never seen a disc equipped Tolly without a servo, but it IS possible that an original unservo'd drum car could be retrofitted with discs but not the accompanying servo. It's a somewhat unsettling thought, as the result of such tomfoolery is what you describe, an iron hard pedal which has very little effect - unless you are Charles Atlas! 20 years or so ago, I bought a 59 Zodiac on which the same thing had been done, you could stop it, but both feet helped!

Since you have a slant fitted already, I would recommend an 1850 servo and master, at least the vac takeoff will already be present on the engine. I can help you with a servo and I think Alun has some single circuit masters in club recon form. It's but a mornings work, bolt out and bolt in and the improvement will astound you!

Steve

Edit, I'm currently building up a set of 256mm vented discs with TJ brackets using late Puma calipers (54mm) and carriers, these have a bigger pad area than the traditional Sierra bits used in TJ conversions and a 17mm disc diameter increase. Of course, they won't fit under Sprint alloys!

[cliftyhanger]

it is a 1972, so probably born with drums.

I was just going to get a new remote servo, and even thought of servo'ing the fronts only (like the late GT6) especially as I have sprint rear drums.

I doubt I will be using 13" wheels on the car again, so I could fit bigger discs than the 240mm ones, but I don't want to get silly.

The brakes on my spit are GT6 calipers with vented GT6 discs (actually redrilled capri) and again no servo. That car stops very well, but it is a lot lighter.

The jury is still out....

But probably both will be fitted! I supect that will blow my ten bob budget

[Carledo]

The Golf discs used on the standard TJ conversion are 239mm and they work perfectly well on the Carledo (with an 1850 servo and dual circuit master) Those who know reckon you don't need to restrict Sprint rears with this setup but I have left my Vauxhall rear brake PCV in place - mainly from inertia!
The bigger disc set I am building is for my upcoming Omega 2.2 (147bhp) powered Sprint auto, I consider it prudent to fit the bigger ones with more pad area on a more powerful and heavier car which has no effective engine braking and which my missus may be driving!

Steve

[AlanH]

If you decide to go down the remote servo route, I have one.

I bought it for my Herald but it doesn't fit on the bulkhead.

P.M. me if you are interested.

[Magenta Auto Sprint]

I have a spare set of front hubs minus discs and callipers, not sure of the wheel stud size; any use?

malcolm

[cliftyhanger]

Kind offer, but I will avoid machining hubs. Think the idea of bolting an alternative disc in the original position is winning now. I have just purchased a pair of mk5/6 escort calipers off the bay. Brand new.....and not a bad price (£63 delivered)
Many thanks
Clive

[cliftyhanger]

Update, the caliper have arrived, lovely that thay are brand new with ford OE pads fitted. Odd design in that they only have a single slider, I seem to remember that from owning as Escort when they were current...
Also got a pair of ferodo discs on their way, just need to get them bored out a tad and then make a bracket. And sort some hoses....

[Carledo]

Finally got my discs back from my local "little man in a shed" so i've assembled up a leg to test it all

256mm discs and late (2001) Puma calipers and carriers on normal TJ adapters.





They fit very nicely within the 5.5 x 14 fake Minilites I am using on the car, in fact I have a hunch they will go under a 13" version of the same wheel.





If anyone else is interested I have the part number of the discs I used, they are listed for Golf and Passat.

quick pic of standard disc on top of mine for reference



Steve

Edit, This definitely WON'T fit under a Sprint alloy, I tried it just to be sure!

[cliftyhanger]

They "may" fit, but probably not! The spit has 245mm capri discs and type 16 callipers, very close. The rears are mgf discs (240mm) and matching callipers. On my own brackets, but pretty tight to the disc. I tried fitting some steel 13" on them and they wouldn't rotate as the rimes had round-head rivets holding them together! the spot-welded type fit, so it is mighty close.

On another note, a remote servo is on order, and I have a girling .75 master cylinder. Need to get a local chappie to bore the golf discs out a tad, and then good to go. Thinking 8mm steel for the calliper brackets.

And b*gger, just noticed Alans post above. I just wish my mind was not as slippery and memory hopeless....

[cliftyhanger]

Today I fitted the new remote servo to the toledo.
It is a 1.9:1 unit, and according to the blurb it is a retrofit for the toledo (and a myriad of other cars from the 60's and 70's)
Anyway. I also fitted a resealed 0.75 master cylinder, genuine girling that came off my vitesse, and bought new by me in 1994. Came from speedy spares, just down the road from me.

Anyway, fitted to the NS inner wing, made up 2 brake pipes (one was supplied with the kit, that was shortened about 6 inches) Fitted the servo take off/non return that I took off the engine when fitted a year or so ago, bled the servo and good to go.

The leg effort has been considerably reduced, but it does not feel over-servoed. The old 5/8 master may well have been too much. So all good.

Now just need to get the new discs bored out and fit the new callipers, but that will have to wait a couple of months, other jobs are taking priority!