olr159w wrote: ↑Thu Feb 08, 2018 1:48 pm
When you say lower bushes do you mean those where the shock connects to the suspension arms or something internal to the shock piston?
We are not talking about rattles here. We're talking about quite clunky noises that are definitely noticeable when pulling off or going around a bend esp at low speed. Not heard on the freeway in a straight line. Knowing the AR bushes looked pretty knackered I still suspect that esp. because of the tendency when cornering.
I replaced the bushes where the front shocks connect to the suspension arms,
thks
Yes, the lower bushes I meant are the ones that connect the shocker to the upper arms, so unlikely to be them then!
It was the clunk when pulling away that made me suspect the pistons as the shox lift slightly on pullaway from weight transfer and this can make them make a noise, usually a single clonk, as you pull off.
I guess there's no harm in fixing the known wear in the ARB bushes anyway and you may get lucky!
Steve
'73 2 door Toledo with Vauxhall Carlton 2.0 8v engine (The Carledo)
'78 Sprint Auto with Vauxhall Omega 2.2 16v engine (The Dolomega)
'72 Triumph 1500FWD in Slate Grey, Now with RWD and Carledo powertrain!
Maverick Triumph, Servicing, Repairs, Electrical, Recomissioning, MOT prep, Trackerjack brake fitting service.
Apprentice served Triumph Specialist for 50 years. PM for more info or quotes.
I was back using the car at the weekend and spent some time concentrating on the noises.
First of all the rattle. I have a video of that where the noise is moderately identifiable. I thought if I shared it those that have experienced the servo valve rattle might be able to identify it straight away but it turns out that its 47Mb. I'm not sure how to get around that. There's no way to post that size of file on here. I suppose I might be able to strip the sound from the video - that would reduce the filesize a lot
As for the clunks :
not there cruising at speed
not heard that much when cornering - either at speed or residential side streets but there occasionally / to an extent
hear it a bit over speed bumps
but by far most distinct when pulling away
Its a hard noise to describe. It's not good. Lowish freq clunks/knocks from "the front" - can't be any more specific than that.
The only two other bits of info are that the car has very poor caster. At the moment the tracking was set by me using a homemade tool but I don't think its way out. Steering is fairly reassuring at speed and I haven't noticed any extreme scrubbing or squeal noises from the tyres. Not sure tracking would affect the caster anyway.
Second I think I did crank up the adjusters on the shocks slightly. I might try easing that off a little.
Richard the old one wrote: ↑Sat Feb 03, 2018 6:49 pm
If it makes the noise when the car is stationary I suspect it could be the braking servo non return valve. I can't explain what is happening but you can prove if it is causing the noise by disconnecting the vacuum pipe from the servo and blanking the rubber vacuum hose so that the engine will continue to run.
I even changed a servo because I thought that it was a problem inside the servo to discover the problem was still there. The replacement servo came with another non return valve but it was only when I fitted a new non return valve that the noise went away.
Please let us all know if you do try this and what the result is.
This rattle you describe sounds just like the one Richard experienced with one of his 'fleet' of cars. I was with him when we tried to diagnose the problem. As Richard states, simply disconnecting the servo vacuum pipe when the car is running (and blanking the end with your hand) will confirm if it is the non return valve rattling - it will stop doing so straight away. Worth a try, takes 1 minute.
Matt Cotton
TDC Oxfordshire Area Organiser.
TDC/TSSC group meeting - 3rd Tuesday of the month
Magenta Auto Sprint wrote: ↑Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:33 pm
I wonder if it could be sub frame mounts that could be lose or deteriorated etc.
it be worth jacking up the front and supporting to body on axle stands and checking sub frame, engine, gearbox mounts, steering rack, tie bars etc.
malcolm
There is a bit of a saga about the subframe mounts in a thread of a year or so ago. The front ones are older poly, the rear ones are recently replaced poly. I will check their tightness. From memory they are tightened to reasonable squishedness but continuing to torque setting results in them getting utterly flattened. Realise there is a crush tube. That exists but relates to "the saga"
I strongly suspect this is all OK. Also the sound doesn't seem to come from the footwell direction - as might be the case with rear subframe at least but feels more at the front.
tony g wrote: ↑Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:02 pm
May be worth checking the strut top nuts under the bonnet. Undo lock nut and see if the main nut tightens any
Tony
World of Thick question but when you say struts you mean the top of the shocks right. Literally the middle centre bolt itself? A thought and I will check thanks. How tight should they be?
Matt Cotton wrote: ↑Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:40 pm
This rattle you describe sounds just like the one Richard experienced with one of his 'fleet' of cars. I was with him when we tried to diagnose the problem. As Richard states, simply disconnecting the servo vacuum pipe when the car is running (and blanking the end with your hand) will confirm if it is the non return valve rattling - it will stop doing so straight away. Worth a try, takes 1 minute.
Thanks for this. Easy test and will try next time I have the chance - which will be at least a couple of weeks away unfortunately.
Yes those ones. They effectively pull down to the stop so the rubbers are under tension. When it stops youll feel it bottom out. Not sure of actual torque sorry. If they instantly start pulling down and compressing the rubbers this could be the problem. ps undo the lock nut first if fitted
tony g wrote: ↑Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:02 pm
May be worth checking the strut top nuts under the bonnet. Undo lock nut and see if the main nut tightens any
Tony
World of Thick question but when you say struts you mean the top of the shocks right. Literally the middle centre bolt itself? A thought and I will check thanks. How tight should they be?
Firstly the good news. There's no doubt the rattly noise behind the dash is the servo non-return valve so I'll be needing to replace that. Does anyone have a view about the best place to source one of these? And how do you remove and replace it into the servo body?
Less good news on the clunky suspension noises. The strut single top bolts weren't super tight but I reckon they were tight enough. That said I tightened them down until they felt fairly tight using a socket ratchet and then tested the car on the road again.
I've driven around a bit and tried to analyse when the clunks are most distinct. Definitely on pulling away and although lack of road noise would emphasise this I feel certain that on the road noises are heard much less - in fact on a smooth motorway or whatever there are no clunky noises at all. Hitting a road dip or lump is sometimes audible but much less distinct than the pulling away experience. I would also say that clunks are more noticeable when turning left than turning right
So thats the deal. Pull out of the drive and feel like the noises are a worry. Get on the Freeway bowling along and other than it being a noisy old car its all good. Weird.
The car does have Gaz adj shocks. I might ease up the settings ie go for softer just to see if that makes a difference.
To replace the non return valve disconnect the vacuum hose from the valve then just prise / wiggle the old valve out from the seal. Then remove the old seal and replace with the new. Then push / wiggle the new non return valve into the new seal. Reconnect vacuum hose. Job done. Should only take a couple of minutes.
When I was investigating this noise I tried a number of old non return valves which came off other cars but they all made a noise. It was only when I fitted a new non return valve that the noise stopped. I even swapped servo units with different non return valves but they all made a noise but worked perfectly as servo's. I can't explain what causes the noise!!! I DO WONDER HOW MANY OTHER CARS SUFFER FROM THIS PROBLEM.
I obtained one from Moss-europe.co.uk. The non return valve is part 18G8953 and they currently show the cost to be £10.80 but you also need to obtain the rubber seal that it pushes into Part BAU1019, costing £3.85,as I suspect you will find that the new non return valve is slightly smaller in diameter than the original non return valve.
This evening I was helping Matt Cotton, my son in law, to change the master brake cylinder on his 1500hl. His car has a dual braking system and while we were doing this I noticed that when a 1500 dolomite has a dual brake master cylinder fitted it is not a simple job to get the non return valve out of the servo as the hydraulic fluid reservoir on the master cylinder prevents the non return valve being removed. If the car has only a single line system there is no problem. I am assuming the same problem will exist on sprints and all other dolomites with dual braking systems. It looks as if the brake mast cylinder would have to be released from the servo to get the non return valve out.
I'm just starting a separate short thread about non return valves.
As for the suspension noises I'm going to try dialling back the adj shock dials because I think I might have left them less forgiving than previously. Not that I can see it should make much difference. Other than that we have the possibility of AR bar bushings being knackered for sure.
Any further thoughts. Feel like I'm grasping at straws.
