Toledo 1500 clutch issue

[Carledo]

In 45+ years of Triumph ownership and fettling, i've never had a thrust washer failure on one of my own cars despite a succession of Heralds, T2000/2.5, Spitfire and GT6 models, all of which have a rep for it. And only witnessed it on a couple of occasions on customers/friends cars. Whilst there is no doubt that the original design is a bit weak, I think the dire warnings of persistent failure here are a bit overemphasised.

Still, it's worth checking, only takes a minute or two!

Steve

[soe8m]

Both my wifes 2500 and my dolomite 1300 had a thrustwasher faillure. The 2500 is automatic and just becamae noisy but the 1300 could not declutch anymore. After checking the clutch hydrolics the axial play of the crankshaft was responsible for the "clutch" faillure. Have seen it on others but also experienced on my own Triumphs.

Jeroen

[Richard the old one]

In response to re5rotary all the slave cylinders I have worked on have had a circlip or retainer as the Haynes manual calls it, to stop the piston coming out of the cylinder. It is shown in the Haynes manual and in official triumph workshop manual. I can see that removing will allow it more travel, provided the master cylinder has not come to the end of its travel and is unlikely to cause a problem. Is leaving it out just a fudge to take up wear ? or is it just left out when slaves have been remanufactured or re-sleeved as a cost saving measure.

I know that some owners put a clamp on the slave cylinder when they are bleeding the system but I have never done this because I knew the ones I was working on had the circlip fitted to prevent the piston coming out.

[TrustNo1]

I know that some owners put a clamp on the slave cylinder when they are bleeding the system but I have never done this because I knew the ones I was working on had the circlip fitted to prevent the piston coming out.

The idea behind using the clamp is to minimise the amount of fluid in the slave which in theory reduces the amount of air that can get trapped.
It's a method that as always worked for me which is why I always recommend that method.

[Robert 352]

Yes the clutch is now working as it was designed to do.

I am a firm believer in doing one thing at a time and in that way eliminate the problem or problems. The suggestions made here were all valid and indeed I followed one of the suggestions given. I started with the simplest knowing that the hydraulics had been bled properly.

The winner then for the chocolate fish (I am not sure how I am going to get a chocolate fish to the other side of the world) for the winner, the one who gave the correct answer to my problem and who resides on the other side of the world was................

Tony - MIG Wielder!

Tony had spotted something which I should have spotted when I put all the hydraulics back in the car and that is, that there is, as I measured it too today, something like 9/64ths of an inch, 4mm, of movement in the slot in which the bolt passes through the side of the slave casing.

I moved the slave forward as far as it would go, clamped it tight, bolted it back in the car, started the car and drove off.

There is a lesson learnt here. I need to take a little more care when assembling items and to check as I go. To be fair this project has been done over many months and I forget where I left off. In the process though I have removed most of the wear around the master cylinder fork and clutch pedal and that coupled with the slave sitting too far back was enough to cause the problem in the first place.

Thank you for your suggestions. Now I can prepare the car for a Warrant of Fitness (WOF) examination and when that is done and the WOF issued I will purchase some car registration which will allow me to drive it legally on the road. It needs a good clean and a polish first.

Robert

If someone can tell me/show me how to edit the header on this thread then it could read .....issue - Resolved

[Richard the old one]

I am glad that the problem is now sorted I think that most Dolomite owners who have been reading this thread will have learnt something.

[re5rotary]

I wasn't suggesting removing the circlip to get more travel simply saying that if the piston hits the circlip you will loose travel. By moving the slave further forward in the bracket the pushrod is moving the piston further back in the bore at the start of its travel. Thus probably stopping the piston hitting the circlip at the end of its travel when your foot is on the floor regards Terry

[Robert 352]

There is I believe an old saying “doesn’t time fly when you are having fun”.

Well time has certainly flown by. It is some three and a half years since I first described the problems I was having with the clutch on this car.

Yes I did manage to get the clutch to operate correctly – in a fashion but it remained somewhat difficult to work the gears unless you pushed the clutch pedal all the way to the floor. And it was even more difficult to engage reverse cleanly. So the car was shunted to the back of the shed while I was having fun elsewhere.

Twelve months ago I dragged it back out into the open so that I could carry out a paint touch up on the two front wings – while I was painting a Sprint which I had acquired. The object of having fun elsewhere.

It was clear that the clutch needed some further attention. It was time therefore to drop the engine and sub frame assembly out of the bottom of the car and lift the body clear. A super easy task on a Toledo with the gearbox attached to the sub frame. It meant that I only had to remove the four sub frame bolts, as well as disconnecting all the services and the prop shaft and removing only the air cleaner off the engine.

The problem with the clutch became clear once I had pulled the clutch housing back and exposed the clutch. Three of the bolts holding the pressure plate assembly were loose which indicated to me that someone had been working on the clutch previously. The clutch plate showed minimal wear, for it had obviously been replaced at some stage. When I grabbed hold of the clutch release bearing the whole clutch fork assembly came away in my hand. The pivot pin on which it swings was missing.

Full marks to cliftyhanger who in his post mentioned the clutch arm pin. He should be the recipient of a chocolate fish too but would somebody mind shouting him a beer on my behalf? Thanks.

When the clutch pedal was depressed the slave actuating rod pushed forward on the clutch fork and the tension on the pressure plate also caused the clutch fork to move away and by looking at the wear marks, swing back, so negating what the actuating rod was trying to achieve.

It is a relatively easy fix although having removed the clutch I am having it rebuilt so that the next owner of the car can drive it in the manner intended.

The cost of a new pin and the tolerance ring which holds it in place is £8.55, plus a similar amount for postage. Instant service from Rimmers which is really appreciated. A cheap fix!

Robert