Signs of water pump failure?

[Sundowner]

Can someone tell me what the first signs of (SPRINT) water pump failure are, please?
Does the thing start to make a noise, and if so, what does it sound like?
My thanks in anticipation,
Rob

[trackerjack]

If the slot in the side of the engine that is located beneath the pump cover is leaking water or oil you have seal problems.
The pump seals off on the bottom of the impellor and if antifreeze is NOT used this face suffers rusting and may leak on start up and then seal as it gets used.
Never run a slant without antifreeze in summer or winter.
There is one more fault that can happen and that is if the jackshaft wears the bore out in which it revolves it starts to put pressure on the pump skew gear which can then fail.

[Sundowner]

Thanks TJ.
There is no oil or coolant leak.
My SPRINT has developed a noise that sounds like a really noisy tappet, but a lot quicker.
When the engine gets a few revs into it the noise begins to sound like a buzz and when it gets around 3500rpm, the noise goes away completely.
Today I had the radiator out and started the car for a few moments, without coolant obviously, while I drove it back into the garage and the noise was louder than before.
I wondered if this could be the water pump impeller vanes striking something. Never having taken one apart, I'm flying blind, so please excuse my ignorance here.
Any suggestions where to aim my investigations when I have a good look at it in the morning?
Cheers,
Rob

[MIG Wielder]

I've had two occasions when there has been a funny rattle from the front end of mine. ( It is an 1850 though ). First thing is Don't Panic !
The first time was one of the fan retaining bolts working loose and rattling against the back of the pulley. It wasn't immediately obvious.

dolly rattly bolt.jpg (115.35 KiB) Viewed 3655 times

The 2nd time it was the front bearing on the alternator.
Disconnect the fan belt to prove this sort of fault if you haven't done already.
Tony.

[Jon Tilson]

Sorry but that isn't a fan retaining bolt....

Its the one that locates through the timing chain guide and cam sprocket support plate and timing cover. Hope you did it back up
quick.

Hmmm....rattly timing chain, but didn't you just replace the tensioner?

Jonners

[Sundowner]

G'Day Tony, TJ and Jonners, Thanks for answering.

Hmmm....rattly timing chain, but didn't you just replace the tensioner?
Jonners

Jonners,
So you feel that the noise I described is from the timing chain?
I had thought of that and wanted to dismiss the idea, because, yes, I put a Jaguar tensioner in it very recently. However, having gone through a recent Rolon tensioner failure, I know the (Chink, chinking) sound of a padless tensioner on chain, and its very different to this fast tappet noise which came on suddenly.
The chain has only done about 2,500kms so I doubt its that.
Thanks,
Rob

[xvivalve]

Does it still have a viscous coupling?

[Jon Tilson]

Nevertheless its a quick job to take off the rocker cover and look at the cam sprocket attachment too as well as the chain itself.
Also look for any sign of blockage in the rocker fingers.

Jonners

[Sundowner]

Alun,
No, it has an electric fan now. Initially I thought the noise was the bearing in the viscous fan hub but replaced it with this new thermatic fan, BUT...the noise is still there.

Nevertheless its a quick job to take off the rocker cover and look at the cam sprocket attachment too as well as the chain itself.
Also look for any sign of blockage in the rocker fingers.
Jonners

Thanks, I'm about to investigate it and I'll get back to you with whatever news I have.
Thanks again,
Rob

[Sundowner]

So, as its always been with this car, it's two steps forward and one step back, but this morning it was one forward and two back.
My mate, a good mechanic, came over, AND early on a Sunday morning too, to offer his advice.
He arrived just as I was putting new coolant into the radiator, now with the new electric fan swinging off it. Unfortunately and embarrassingly, he saw, just as I did, that the radiator started leaking from when I pushed the long bolts through the core and accidentally nicked one of the tubes.
But that didn't stop us from starting it and trying to track down "the noise".
As it has me, its got him baffled. After using his stethoscope it turns out its definitely NOT in the timing case, but it does seem to be towards the front of the engine, internal, and below the Jackshaft. The noise has absolutely no effect on the engines performance and in some instances, has disappeared altogether. But just as I start to breath a sigh of relief that its gone, its back again.
His advice to me is to keep driving the car, but to keep a close eye (& ear too, I suppose) on it. I'll take his advice just as soon as I get my leaking radiator fixed and back in the car.
Cheers,
Rob
PS; Excuse all the, for want of a better word, smilie faces. I got carried away.

[xvivalve]

Have you tried running it without the alternator belt on to see if it is related to the alternator?

[Sundowner]

Have you tried running it without the alternator belt on to see if it is related to the alternator?

Thank you Alun and Yes, we have. I was hoping it was something simple like that but alas and sigh..........instead of the usual damn and blast.
Thanks again,
Rob

[tony g]

The tensioner is below the jackshaft and i know you dont want to go there again but maybe its coming loose (bolts) ?

Tony

[tony g]

On that train of thought, the first sprint engine mine had, had the jackshaft sprocket bolt loose and it sheared off the dowel pin after a switch off when idling too high. Just in case you do remove the front cover check that too.

Tony

[trackerjack]

Well we are in an area now that is "what if" I will offer another scenario and one I hope is wrong.
It seems to me that the younger Sprint engines from 76 on suffer from a quality issue of the engine crank case material that causes the jackshaft to wear the bore that it runs in, this puts pressure on the water pump skew gear and could break a tooth.
I had a 1980 sprint engine in my first kit car that I built and the jackshaft ate the distributer drive gear.
This was repaired and then finally it ate the water pump gear
My son was with me when this happened in 1996 and I vowed to him that I was never going to sit behind another sprint lump
A year later I bought a sprint that stayed with me till Sept 2013