Actually, what are the odds?

[GrahamFountain]

Going through bits of spare interior and looking at a glove box lid for re-varnishing, and I though do I have a key that fits this lock?
So the first key I tried was the one for the Sprint, which fits both glove box and boot - though I have two different keys that fit the boot.
Surprisingly, it fits perfectly.

So I know it's a three digit number, which could mean 1 in a 1000, but how many different keys were there, and how many different ones fit a used glove box lock - which I suspect sees least use of the two.

Graham

[marshman]

Actually the odds are a lot less than you think.A similar topic came up on the Standard Motor Club forum recently and it transpires that the various series of keys used by the UK car industry over the years did not use the full 001 - 999 number range. MRN, FA, FP and FS only span a few hundred. As I recall the FS series - which I am guessing yours is - only had numbers from 1 to 99 and 876 to 955 so 1 in 179 (approx) quite worrying really! Later FT keys (double sided) had a few more codes.

Useful table here: http://britishcarkeys.com/keyinformation.html

I'm pretty sure that the reason is that the lock barrel mechanism limits the number of combinations. Most barrels I am aware of in the above series have 5 tumblers or pins, and each pin I think from the ones I have looked at have three possible levels. So the number of possible combinations is only 3^5 (three to the power 5) which is 243



Roger

[xvivalve]

Only FS876 - FS955 were used on Dolomites though, so it's actually a 1 in 80 chance!

[cleverusername]

Also doesn't it depend on how worn the lock is? I have heard people say you can open many old cars with pretty much anything, as the locks are so worn.

[GrahamFountain]

Obviously a sample of 1 is a bit small to mean much, but even at 80:1 against, finding a spare lock for the glove box seems lucky.

I did check this lock against three other FS keys I have from the Herald and such, and it only fits the one off the Sprint glove box lock. And I don't think the glove box lock will wear like door and ignition locks. The Herald being rather forgiving in both those cases. The Spint door lock on the other hand is very, very secure and couldn't possibly be opened with the can opener on a pocket knife or a house lock key ever.

Graham

[Carledo]

The glove box lock is the one that carries the number of the matched pair (glovebox and boot) so it's easy enough to check if you did by chance get the right key or one that was "close enough" It's the boot lock where one is really up against it!

When I dismantle cars I always keep paired locks together to avoid this sort of problem, even then, they don't ALWAYS match because of replacements over time.

Steve

[GrahamFountain]

No number I can see on this glove box lock, either on the front face or under the back shroud.
Graham

[xvivalve]

It's the boot lock where one is really up against it!

Nope, they are number stamped also.

[xvivalve]

No number I can see on this glove box lock, either on the front face or under the back shroud.
Graham

Every glove box lock I've had has had the number stamped into the grey alloy lock body. Some you can see with the shroud on, some you can't.

[GrahamFountain]

Found it under some muck om the side of the square lump. And it is the same.
Graham

[RobSun]

In the mid 70s I was running a new Hillman Hunter and my sister had a three year old Imp. I could open up her Imp, which didn't impress her much, with my Hunter key but it did not work the other way, so wear even after a short time is probably a factor.

[Carledo]

It's the boot lock where one is really up against it!

Nope, they are number stamped also.

Every day a school day! Where exactly? I've never found one on a boot lock and have a good handful without keys!

Steve

[xvivalve]

It is stamped on the cam.

[rvfrc45]

Hi, just been reading about the locks,
Hope this makes you laugh. My late Dad bought from new a silver fox coloured Mk 1 escort.
He was a insurance man and after coming out of a clients house climbed into a silver escort.
He then got accused of trying to steal it and it all got rather heated.
When he climbed out he in fact had got in the wrong car and his was parked a few cars away. lol.
PS seems one key fits all.