From Pepipoo.com ...
The government’s proposal to introduce road pricing will mean you having to purchase a tracking device for your car and paying a monthly bill to use it.
The tracking device will cost about £200 and in a recent study by the BBC, the lowest monthly bill was £28 for a rural florist and £194 for a delivery driver.
A non working Mum who used the car to take the kids to school paid £86 in one month.
On top of this massive increase in tax, you will be tracked. Somebody will know where you are at all times. They will also know how fast you have been going, so even if you accidentally creep over a speed limit you can expect an NIP with your monthly bill.
If you care about our freedoms and stopping the constant bashing of the car driver, please sign the petition on No 10's new website:
http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/traveltax/
ps Hotmail accounts are blocking emails from this petition site so suggest use another one if you have one.
sign here
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1300dolly
quote.
A non working Mum who used the car to take the kids to school paid £86 in one month.
unquote
yeh and i bet not only does she drive a 4x4 but she live 5 minutes walk away from the schooll which takes 15 minutes to drive or lives on a bus route with a bus that stops outside the school , (50p bus fare x 20 school days = £20 ,return)
A non working Mum who used the car to take the kids to school paid £86 in one month.
unquote
yeh and i bet not only does she drive a 4x4 but she live 5 minutes walk away from the schooll which takes 15 minutes to drive or lives on a bus route with a bus that stops outside the school , (50p bus fare x 20 school days = £20 ,return)
duh
Blimey Alun, never had you down as one of the more money than sense brigade. Do you really think this or any other government would make such a scheme a replacement for a current tax? No chance, it'll be an additional.
Do you have confidence they'll make a distinction between cars in use and those not when we have to pay £200 per for the black box? It makes no sense for me to have to tag the pile of crates that makes up my Spitfire but I have zero confidence that the govt of the day will use sense. How many cars registered to you now? We all already pay usage based tax. The more I drive the more fuel I need and so the more tax I pay. Why do we need another tax to do the same job?
Yes the busiest roads are clogged at peak times but that is resulting in pressure on employers for more flexible working. Parents working from home or working flexible hours results in them having more time for their family which has got to be a real benfit to society. Would additional cost at peak hours accelerate this trend? Or just p155 people off, make a shitload for the electronics companies and quangos that mismanage the scheme and not forgetting the vampires, sorry lawyers, who rake it in fining someone every time their box 'breaks'.
Tinweevil
Do you have confidence they'll make a distinction between cars in use and those not when we have to pay £200 per for the black box? It makes no sense for me to have to tag the pile of crates that makes up my Spitfire but I have zero confidence that the govt of the day will use sense. How many cars registered to you now? We all already pay usage based tax. The more I drive the more fuel I need and so the more tax I pay. Why do we need another tax to do the same job?
Yes the busiest roads are clogged at peak times but that is resulting in pressure on employers for more flexible working. Parents working from home or working flexible hours results in them having more time for their family which has got to be a real benfit to society. Would additional cost at peak hours accelerate this trend? Or just p155 people off, make a shitload for the electronics companies and quangos that mismanage the scheme and not forgetting the vampires, sorry lawyers, who rake it in fining someone every time their box 'breaks'.
Tinweevil
1978 Pageant Sprint - the rustomite, 1972 Spitfire IV - sprintfire project, 1968 Valencia GT6 II - little Blue, 1980 Vermillion 1500HL - resting. 1974 Sienna 1500TC, Mrs Weevils big brown.
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xvivalve
- TDC West Mids Area Organiser
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Ah...but I'm an employer!pressure on employers for more flexible working. Parents working from home or working flexible hours
My old fashioned stance is if you chose to have children then (one of you) stay at home, look after them, bring them up with proper guidance and respect. They are not a fashion accessory, they are the future; sadly all too many see children as status symbols, the next tick in the box, accessories to a social life with the 'we had children at the same time but have nothing in common club' and an X5 to take them to school and natter about nothing to your 'new friends' is part of that. Schools in towns are local enough for children to walk to; spurious use of vehicles to transport them should be taxed and taxed highly.
Why should my business have to work harder to pay for that lifestyle and second rate childcare?
Simple fact, impallatable as it is, society costs money, it has to come from somewhere. Tax is inevitable; we should not be too concerned about how its dressed up that we have to pay, we should concentrate on how and where the mindless morons spend it! Governing the spend we can reduce the liability on us in the first place.
Cherry Blairs pre-election coiffure budget...makes me puke!
Hmm, possibly a slightly OTT tirade but I've a massive headache and can't be arsed to rewrite it.
Which brings up another relavent point. Human beings are fundamentally lazy. I am, you reading this are, everyone is. It's not just programmed into the species it's programmed into the universe. Does electricity take the neatest or most sensible path or that of least resistance? A slightly oddball question but consider it for a while. Every physical constant you can name basically does the minimum work it has to to get it's job done. So do humans. Sorry but that bloke always will drive his dogs to the park and I will drive the 1/2 mile to the shop rather than run when we realise as Mrs Weevil is serving up we've no wine left in the house. It's human nature. If we were taxed via tracking the 0.02p that journey add to my annual bill would make so little difference that I'd just go on being lazy.
Tinweevil
Which brings up another relavent point. Human beings are fundamentally lazy. I am, you reading this are, everyone is. It's not just programmed into the species it's programmed into the universe. Does electricity take the neatest or most sensible path or that of least resistance? A slightly oddball question but consider it for a while. Every physical constant you can name basically does the minimum work it has to to get it's job done. So do humans. Sorry but that bloke always will drive his dogs to the park and I will drive the 1/2 mile to the shop rather than run when we realise as Mrs Weevil is serving up we've no wine left in the house. It's human nature. If we were taxed via tracking the 0.02p that journey add to my annual bill would make so little difference that I'd just go on being lazy.
Tinweevil
1978 Pageant Sprint - the rustomite, 1972 Spitfire IV - sprintfire project, 1968 Valencia GT6 II - little Blue, 1980 Vermillion 1500HL - resting. 1974 Sienna 1500TC, Mrs Weevils big brown.
Would this scheme really manage anything tho? Would all the income go directly into improving our lot? I doubt it. Th money would just go in the treasury pot and it'd just be another department full of beancounters, fine enforcers and other general human detritus for those that do the real work to pay for. If we need higher per-use tax then increase the tax thats already in place. That costs nothing in wasted and duplicated effort.
I have no objection with local taxes via parking permits to deal with chelsea tractors but it really gets my goat to be paying for yet another building full of administrators.
Society does cost money to run but the only place that money is coming from is society. Every new rule just makes the same money go round and round faster with increasing wastage along the way.
Everything about cherry bliar makes me puke.
Tinweevil
I have no objection with local taxes via parking permits to deal with chelsea tractors but it really gets my goat to be paying for yet another building full of administrators.
Society does cost money to run but the only place that money is coming from is society. Every new rule just makes the same money go round and round faster with increasing wastage along the way.
Everything about cherry bliar makes me puke.
Tinweevil
1978 Pageant Sprint - the rustomite, 1972 Spitfire IV - sprintfire project, 1968 Valencia GT6 II - little Blue, 1980 Vermillion 1500HL - resting. 1974 Sienna 1500TC, Mrs Weevils big brown.
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1300dolly
for once i agree with everything Alun is saying but i wouldn't read too much into any goverment idea.
supernannys!! 80 for all the countrys wayward kids!
having to take one years of riding test to ride a motorbike and not letting new riders out at night or on main roads.
56 mph speed restictions on all vechiles over 3.5 tonnes(including our police accident response recovery trucks!)
rant over for now so andy doesn't lock this.
supernannys!! 80 for all the countrys wayward kids!
having to take one years of riding test to ride a motorbike and not letting new riders out at night or on main roads.
56 mph speed restictions on all vechiles over 3.5 tonnes(including our police accident response recovery trucks!)
rant over for now so andy doesn't lock this.
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1300mash
Fair enough it might make people think about taking the car for short journeys but I hope this 200 quid box is not one per car, that's £600 I'd have to fork out - I can't justify that. The classic car movement will die almost overnight because people won't be able to afford to run more than one car. It ought to be transferable between vehicles, after all I can't drive all three of mine at once.
Besides why should I have to have someone knowing where I am all the time? I'm not some criminal lowlife that has to be tagged 24/7.
Besides why should I have to have someone knowing where I am all the time? I'm not some criminal lowlife that has to be tagged 24/7.
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pmn74
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smifter
Its almost here Alun, it wont be long and Mobile phones will be able to send you adverts on the go based on where you are, what car you drive, what make of baked beans you bought last week and what colour undercrackers your wearing. I can't say too much but our comms department work with the Highways agency and the information systems they are working on are scary.
I'm with you to a degree on the parenthood thing, I'm lucky that I earn enough that i can now just about afford for Carol to stay at home and bring up the kids, but she wont have a car (the lovely V6 Audi will be going
), we wont have any fancy holidays and if we are lucky, we might just be able to put enough aside for me to tinker with the Dolomite from time to time. My kids can bloody walk or cycle to school and I wont put up with lazy fat stroppy spoilt lumps. It would be too easy for us to both carry on earning and living a luxury lifestyle and pay a childminder full time but we take our parental responsibilities too seriously to consider it. On the flip side, it must be tough for those not fortunate enough to have got on the property ladder at the right time in the right area and to be earning an average wage. Its sadly easy for these people to just give up trying to make a better life for themselves and sponge off benefits instead.
Life is s##t for most people, most young parents dont own holiday homes and drive X5's and are constantly fighting an overdraft in order to keep food in the cupboard.
The road charging scheme is going to fleece us regardless.
I'm with you to a degree on the parenthood thing, I'm lucky that I earn enough that i can now just about afford for Carol to stay at home and bring up the kids, but she wont have a car (the lovely V6 Audi will be going
), we wont have any fancy holidays and if we are lucky, we might just be able to put enough aside for me to tinker with the Dolomite from time to time. My kids can bloody walk or cycle to school and I wont put up with lazy fat stroppy spoilt lumps. It would be too easy for us to both carry on earning and living a luxury lifestyle and pay a childminder full time but we take our parental responsibilities too seriously to consider it. On the flip side, it must be tough for those not fortunate enough to have got on the property ladder at the right time in the right area and to be earning an average wage. Its sadly easy for these people to just give up trying to make a better life for themselves and sponge off benefits instead. Life is s##t for most people, most young parents dont own holiday homes and drive X5's and are constantly fighting an overdraft in order to keep food in the cupboard.
The road charging scheme is going to fleece us regardless.
Last edited by smifter on Thu Nov 23, 2006 10:05 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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smifter
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xvivalve
- TDC West Mids Area Organiser
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Its all about where we as individuals place priorities irrespective of the perception of luxury. Personally the well being of any as yet unconceived child of mine will be put before the 'need' for flat screen tellies, foriegn holidays or thelatest beemer in the drive. For many the reverse is true and yes, whilst life is hard (is that the word you couldn't spell?) for many, consumer aspiration will lead decisions over the nurture requirement of offspring. I have friends who 'struggle' to meet £1200 monthly nursery costs because the wife refuses to give up work because "she'd miss her friends she works with"; she doesn't even bring that much home herself, the child is 13 months old and they are now missing all of the 'firsts'!??
Frankly I would struggle with current budgets to afford to raise children. Were children to happen along then sacrifices would have to be made...for their sake and not mine. House projects and car projects and ski trips would be no more and I'd probably get an allotment to 'amuse' us all at weekends...how bizzare!
Frankly I would struggle with current budgets to afford to raise children. Were children to happen along then sacrifices would have to be made...for their sake and not mine. House projects and car projects and ski trips would be no more and I'd probably get an allotment to 'amuse' us all at weekends...how bizzare!